1 1 IN THE SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA 2 IN AND FOR THE COUNTY OF SAN FRANCISCO 3 CIVIL UNLIMITED JURISDICTION 4 5 MYDRA MCGARR, ) ) 6 Plaintiff, ) ) 7 v. ) No. CGC-08-478204 ) 8 TENDERLOIN HOUSING CLINIC, ) INC., CHANEL SAMUEL, and DOES ) 9 1 to 25, inclusive, ) ) 10 Defendants. ) _____________________________ ) 11 12 13 14 15 16 DEPOSITION OF 17 COLLEEN CARRIGAN 18 SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA 19 THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 5, 2009 20 21 ATKINSON-BAKER, INC. COURT REPORTERS 22 (800) 288-3376 www.depo.com 23 24 REPORTED BY: PATRICIA E. SEGOVIA, CSR NO. 8416 25 FILE NO.: A301139 2 1 IN THE SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA 2 IN AND FOR THE COUNTY OF SAN FRANCISCO 3 CIVIL UNLIMITED JURISDICTION 4 5 MYDRA MCGARR, ) ) 6 Plaintiff, ) ) 7 v. ) No. CGC-08-478204 ) 8 TENDERLOIN HOUSING CLINIC, ) INC., CHANEL SAMUEL, and DOES ) 9 1 to 25, inclusive, ) ) 10 Defendants. ) _____________________________ ) 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 Deposition of COLLEEN CARRIGAN, taken on 18 behalf of Plaintiff, at the Law Offices of WILLIAM E. 19 WEISS, 130 Sutter Street, 7th Floor, San Francisco, 20 California 95008, commencing at 9:45 a.m., Thursday, 21 February 5, 2009, before PATRICIA E. SEGOVIA, CSR NO. 22 8416. 23 24 25 3 1 A P P E A R A N C E S 2 FOR THE PLAINTIFF: 3 LAW OFFICES OF WILLIAM E. WEISS By: WILLIAM E. WEISS 4 130 Sutter Street 7th Floor 5 San Francisco, California 94104 (415)362-6765 6 7 FOR THE DEFENDANTS: 8 KENNICK & ASSOCIATES By: JOHN ELLIS 9 110 E. Wilshire Avenue Suite 401 10 Fullerton, California 92832 (714) 992-6600 11 12 ALSO PRESENT: AMY SPIERING. 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 4 1 I N D E X 2 WITNESS: COLLEEN CARRIGAN 3 EXAMINATION PAGE 4 MR. WILLIAM E. WEISS 6, 169 5 MR. JOHN ELLIS 169 6 EXHIBITS: 7 No. Item Page 8 1 Notice of Deposition 12 9 2 Rental Agreement, Looper Residence, and House 10 Rules 57 11 3 Drug and Alcohol Use Policy 63 12 4 Rental Agreement, Hartland Hotel, and House 13 Rules 65 14 5 Incident Report - Hartland Hotel dated 15 5/29/08 88 16 6 Incident Report - Hartland Hotel dated 17 5/29/08 91 18 7 E-mail string with the top one dated 19 5/29/08 94 20 8 Incident Report - Hartland Hotel dated 21 5/30/08 103 22 9 Lease Addendum for Drug Free Housing 124 23 10 Hartland Hotel Final Written Violation 24 Notice 126 25 11 Eviction Request 138 5 1 12 Nuisance Eviction Request 141 2 13 Notice of Belief of Abandonment 147 3 14 E-mail string with top one dated 6/17/08 151 4 15 E-mail dated 6/17/08 153 5 16 Tenant Move-Out Form 155 6 17 Code of Safe Practices 161 7 18 Drug and Alcohol Use Policy 162 8 19 Anti-Harassment Policy 163 9 20 Code of Professional Conduct/Staff Rules 164 10 21 Tenderloin Housing Clinic Administrative Policy 11 Acknowledgment and Receipt Form 165 12 QUESTIONS WITNESS INSTRUCTED NOT TO ANSWER: 13 (None.) 14 INFORMATION TO BE SUPPLIED: 15 (None.) 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 6 1 COLLEEN CARRIGAN, 2 having first been duly sworn, was 3 examined and testified as follows: 4 EXAMINATION BY MR. WILLIAM E. WEISS 5 BY MR. WEISS: 6 Q. Do you want to give us your name and address 7 for the record? 8 MR. ELLIS: I'm sorry for interrupting 9 already. She would rather not give her personal 10 address. Can she give her work address? 11 MR. WEISS: Okay. As long as, you know -- I 12 don't know -- let's say for whatever reason she wasn't 13 working anymore at the THC and we would want to subpoena 14 her, that you would somehow facilitate the subpoena to 15 produce her for whatever event it would be, as long as 16 you'll agree to that, that's fine with me. 17 MR. ELLIS: Yes. Yes. 18 THE WITNESS: So you need my name and address? 19 BY MR. WEISS: 20 Q. Yes. And you can give us your business 21 address. 22 A. Sure. Colleen Carrigan. 449 Turk Street, 23 San Francisco, 94102. 24 Q. Ms. Carrigan, my name is Bill Weiss. We 25 methamphetamine early this morning. I think I might 7 1 have seen you once down in court. I represent Mydra 2 McGarr in this lawsuit against the THC. I am going to 3 be asking you some questions today about various events 4 regarding the assault, the way the THC run things and so 5 on. Before I get into that, let me ask you a few 6 questions. Have you ever had your deposition taken 7 before? 8 A. I have not. 9 Q. And I assume you've had some time to discuss 10 the deposition or what might go on with your attorney? 11 A. I have. 12 Q. And we don't ask about anything that you 13 discuss with your attorney, that's privileged. I just 14 want to make sure that you had some prep time. But I am 15 going to go over some of the rules of the deposition 16 anyway. 17 So you are under oath. And even though we are 18 sitting here in my office today and we are all dressed 19 informally, the oath that you took is the same one you 20 take as if you were testifying in court. Do you 21 understand that? 22 A. I do. 23 Q. You have to speak up so the court reporter can 24 take down your words. The court reporter is going to 25 take down everything that we say here today and put it 8 1 into a transcript. And some time after the deposition, 2 you'll have a chance to review the transcript and you 3 can make any changes in it that you would like. You can 4 change any answer, anything that's in there. 5 If you do, however, it may -- we may be able 6 to comment on the changes later on in the case that 7 could prove embarrassing or it could even amount to 8 impeachment. So today when you give your answers, just 9 try and give it your best shot. 10 The other thing is, you don't have to guess or 11 speculate. And in this case, it probably would involve 12 a date or some other type of thing. But we are entitled 13 to your best estimate. So if we ask you a question, 14 where it would have to be an estimate, just say so, just 15 qualify your answer with that, that's okay. 16 Again, we can only talk one person at a time 17 so the court reporter can get a clear record. You also 18 have to answer in some sort of audible or understandable 19 words so we can get that on the record as well. You 20 can't answer a question "uh-uh" or "uh-huh" because that 21 might not be clear later on or nod your head or make a 22 gesture in answer to a question. That may not be 23 interpreted correctly later on. 24 If you need to take a break for any reason, we 25 are glad to do it, just say so, we will be glad to do 9 1 that. And that's about it. 2 And in your deposition notice -- I know your 3 counsel mentioned this prior to starting -- we asked you 4 to bring a few things with you. 5 Did you review any writings to prepare for the 6 deposition today? 7 A. No. 8 Q. No documents? Nothing? 9 A. No. 10 Q. And did you get subpoenaed to testify in the 11 preliminary hearing in People versus Chanel Samuel? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. You did. Do you have your subpoena? 14 A. I do not. 15 Q. Do you know where it is? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Do you have copies of any records regarding 18 any dispute mediated between any case manager and Mydra 19 McGarr and Chanel Samuel? 20 A. With me today? 21 Q. Yes. 22 A. No. 23 Q. Do such records exist? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Okay. 10 1 MR. ELLIS: I'm not sure that they do. Repeat 2 that again? And listen specifically to what he is 3 asking you. 4 BY MR. WEISS: 5 Q. You were asked to bring copies of any records 6 regarding any dispute mediated between any case manager 7 and Plaintiff Mydra McGarr and Chanel Samuel. 8 MR. ELLIS: Records of a case manager 9 mediating a dispute -- 10 THE WITNESS: No. I'm sorry, I misunderstood 11 your question. 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. What did you think I was talking about? 14 A. If there were records pertaining to the 15 incident on May 30th or May 29th. I'm sorry, whatever 16 date that was. 17 Q. Okay. But are you aware of any disputes 18 mediated between any case manager and Plaintiff Mydra 19 McGarr and Chanel Samuel? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Did you look to see if there were any? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Any particular reason why not? 24 A. I didn't know one existed. 25 Q. I am not saying there is. I am just saying 11 1 did you look to see if there were any? That's a 2 different question. 3 A. Did I look to see if there were any disputes? 4 Q. No. Did you look to see whether there were 5 any records regarding any disputes mediated between any 6 case manager and Mydra McGarr and Chanel Samuel? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Any particular reason you didn't look for 9 those? 10 A. I didn't know -- I had no reason to look for 11 something I didn't know happened. 12 Q. You never saw your depo notice? I guess not. 13 Did you know there was a notice of deposition for you? 14 A. For today? 15 Q. Yes. 16 A. Yes. 17 MR. ELLIS: Can I interject? 18 MR. WEISS: Sure. 19 MR. ELLIS: I did show her the categories of 20 documents requested by e-mail and I also checked with 21 case managers and with HR and no such documents exist 22 responsive to that request. 23 BY MR. WEISS: 24 Q. Okay. But no one ever asked you to look for 25 any? 12 1 I don't want to get into conversations between 2 you and your attorney. Let's just leave it broadly put. 3 Did anyone ever tell you -- We'll call the 4 Tenderloin Housing Clinic just THC. Did anyone over 5 there ever tell you to look for documents for your 6 deposition today? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Okay. And do you have any documents 9 concerning testimony at the preliminary hearing in 10 People versus Chanel Samuel? 11 A. No. 12 Q. Have you ever seen a transcript of that 13 hearing? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Do you know if one exists? 16 A. I don't. 17 Q. Okay. We will mark this as Plaintiff's 18 Exhibit 1, the depo notice. 19 (Notice of Deposition marked Plaintiff's Exhibit 20 No. 1 for identification.) 21 BY MR. WEISS: 22 Q. Now, aside from talking to Mr. Ellis about 23 your deposition today, have you talked to anyone else at 24 the Tenderloin Housing Clinic about your deposition? 25 A. My supervisor. 13 1 Q. And that would be who? 2 A. James Holland. 3 Q. What was your discussion with Mr. Holland? 4 A. What my schedule would be for today, that I 5 was going to be deposed. 6 Q. When did you have that discussion? 7 A. An estimate would be after I heard from John 8 that it would be occurring today, so earlier this week. 9 Q. And what is Mr. Holland's title? 10 A. He is the Director of Property Management. 11 Q. Except for just discussing the schedule for 12 your work with Mr. Holland, no other discussion about 13 the deposition? 14 A. Not that I recall. 15 Q. Did you ever discuss this lawsuit with 16 Mr. Holland at any time prior to today? 17 A. I think when we learned of it, he informed me 18 that it was happening, that it had been filed. 19 Q. How did that take place? In other words, 20 phone call, e-mail, or what? 21 A. In person. He works right across the hall 22 from me. 23 Q. Okay. What did he say? 24 A. I don't recall specifically. I think he 25 notified me that we were, as an agency, named as a 14 1 defendant. 2 Q. Did you ever see a copy of the lawsuit? 3 A. No. 4 Q. Do you know what is even alleged in the 5 lawsuit? 6 A. I don't. 7 Q. Okay. How about anyone else at the THC, have 8 you talked to them about the lawsuit? 9 A. The HR director. 10 Q. And who would that be? 11 A. Janie Lara. 12 Q. How do you spell Lara? 13 A. L-A-R-A. 14 Q. And what was your discuss with Ms. Lara? 15 A. My discussion -- I think she informed me as 16 well that we were named as a defendant. 17 Q. And did that occur at a different time than 18 Mr. Holland telling you? 19 A. I believe so. 20 Q. Was it before or after Mr. Holland told you? 21 A. I don't recall. 22 Q. And what did she say to you when she notified 23 you about it? 24 A. An estimate would be that we were being named 25 as a defendant and that I would probably be a part of 15 1 that because I was the supervisor of one of the people 2 involved in the incident. 3 Q. Which person would that be? 4 A. That would have been Chanel. 5 Q. What was your job title at the time that this 6 happened? 7 A. Lead Property Supervisor. 8 Q. And why would you be Ms. Samuel's supervisor? 9 A. At the time, I was given the responsibility of 10 supervising the floating janitors. 11 Q. Okay. And how about Randy Shaw, have you ever 12 talked to him about this lawsuit? 13 A. About this lawsuit? 14 Q. Correct. 15 A. I just called him yesterday to let him know 16 that I was being deposed today. 17 Q. Why did you call him? 18 A. I was unaware if he knew of this lawsuit so I 19 left him a voice mail to say I would be out of the 20 office being deposed. 21 Q. What is Mr. Shaw's position at the Tenderloin 22 Housing Clinic? 23 A. He is the Executive Director. 24 Q. And this call about your deposition today, was 25 that just of your own volition just to let him know what 16 1 was going on? 2 A. It was. 3 Q. What did you say in that telephone call? 4 A. I recall saying that I would be at a 5 deposition tomorrow, not sure if he knew that there was 6 a lawsuit but I wanted to give him that information. 7 Q. Did you actually speak to him? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Just voice mail? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Did he ever contact you after that? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. What with Jesus's last name? Is it Lopez? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. How about Jesus, did you ever talk to him 16 about this lawsuit? 17 A. I did, in regards to the depositions. 18 Q. What was your discussion with him? 19 A. That he would be deposed and that a man by the 20 name of John Ellis would be contacting him with further 21 information. 22 Q. And any particular reason you left a message 23 like that for Jesus? 24 A. I didn't leave a message for Jesus. 25 Q. I'm sorry. That you had this discussion with 17 1 Mr. Lopez? 2 A. I supervise him and he needs to know what his 3 schedule may be. 4 Q. Do you know if his deposition is planned? 5 A. I believe it is, yes. 6 Q. And anyone else at the Tenderloin Housing 7 Clinic that you talked to about the lawsuit other than 8 what you've told us? 9 A. No. 10 Q. Now -- I am going to get ahead of myself here. 11 But you've had discussions with Mr. Lopez about the 12 incident, though, haven't you? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Actually, we will get into that in a little 15 bit. Could you be a capsule summary of your educational 16 background? 17 A. Sure. I graduated college in 1999 with a 18 bachelor's in political science. 19 Q. From where? 20 A. Wheeling Jesuit University. 21 Q. Where is that located? 22 A. Wheeling, West Virginia. 23 Q. Are you from West Virginia? 24 A. I am. 25 Q. What about after college? 18 1 A. I don't have any post bachelor, so no graduate 2 degree. 3 Q. Aside from post graduate work, though, is 4 there any other kind of educational courses that you 5 took that ended up with some sort of certificate or 6 other type -- piece of paper that would show you 7 completed the course? 8 A. I've been to several professional development 9 trainings. I believe I've received certificates in some 10 of those. 11 Q. Can you give me an example? 12 A. Two day courses on fair housing and 13 employment. 14 Landlord tenant law. 15 Supervision trainings. 16 Q. Were those taken in San Francisco? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. And were they at any particular institution? 19 A. Compass Point Nonprofit Services. 20 I'm forgetting who did the fair employment 21 training. 22 Aides Legal Referral Panel on landlord tenant 23 law. 24 Q. And prior to working at the THC -- Why don't 25 we do it this way. Can you give me a capsule summary of 19 1 your work history since college? 2 A. Sure. The Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights. 3 Do you need years? 4 Q. Sure. 5 A. 1999, August 1999 to August 2000. 6 Q. What did you do there? 7 A. I served as a paralegal/legal intake 8 coordinator. 9 Q. For what kind of cases? 10 A. Pro bono. Civil matters. Landlord-tenant 11 law. Eviction. School expulsion. Retail 12 discrimination. 13 Q. Was that here in San Francisco? 14 A. It is. 15 Q. And what about after that? 16 A. The Jesuit Volunteer Corp, from August 2000 17 through September 2001. 18 Q. What did you do there? 19 A. I was an office administrator, office work. 20 Q. Okay. And after that? 21 A. I worked for the eviction defense 22 collaborative from September 2001 to March 2005. My 23 title was volunteer manager. And I did a variety of 24 managing the volunteer program, conducting intakes for 25 tenants being evicted, and doing the majority of the 20 1 office, HR paperwork, city reports, and things like 2 that. 3 Q. What years was that again? 4 A. Sure. September 2001 through March 2005. 5 Q. And after that? 6 A. March 2005 I was hired as a case manager for 7 the Tenderloin Housing Clinic. I did -- I worked as a 8 case manager from March 2005 to approximately May 2006. 9 From May 2006 I was hired as a support service 10 manager. I supervised eight case managers. I did that 11 until approximately January 2008. 12 January 2008 I was hired as a lead property 13 supervisor, still with Tenderloin Housing Clinic, and I 14 am doing that presently. 15 Q. When you say you were hired as the lead 16 property supervisor, do you mean promoted? 17 A. I was interviewed and I was offered and I took 18 the position. 19 Q. But you were already working at the Tenderloin 20 Housing Clinic. Right? 21 A. I was. I was interviewed for each position 22 within the agency. 23 Q. And when you go from one position to another, 24 do you consider that a separate hire as opposed to just 25 getting promoted? 21 1 A. There is an interview process so it was a job 2 posting, so it wasn't offered just internally. 3 Q. Oh, I see. So the Tenderloin Housing Clinic 4 puts out a want ad for the job and you are aware of it 5 so you apply for that from whatever position you are in. 6 Is that how it works? 7 A. It is. There is always postings at least a 8 week ahead of time internally and also externally and I 9 interviewed and was hired for those positions. 10 Q. What was your job as case manager? 11 A. I worked directly with tenants. I had about 12 85 tenants at the Mission Hotel that I had on a case 13 load. I worked more intensively with about 25 tenants. 14 I helped them maintain their housing by working with 15 them on rental issues, employment issues, day-to-day 16 living skills, and if there was any mental health 17 issues, substance use, all in the goal of helping them 18 retain their house. 19 Q. And as I understand it, some of the tenants 20 have problems with drugs? 21 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague and ambiguous. 22 Calls for speculation. 23 BY MR. WEISS: 24 Q. Well, isn't it true that some tenants of the 25 Tenderloin Housing Clinic have problems with substance 22 1 abuse? 2 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. Do you know what I mean by substance abuse? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Okay. And just so we are clear on the record, 7 what is your interpretation of substance abuse? 8 A. I would say substance use and I would say 9 people who use substances, and that looks like alcohol 10 and drugs, elicit and illicit. 11 Q. Illicit being drugs like methamphetamine? 12 A. That would be one. 13 Q. Heroin? 14 A. Sure. 15 Q. Methadone? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Marijuana? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Barbiturates? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Narcotics in general? Heroin is a narcotic, I 22 know. But any other kind of narcotics? Like OxyContin, 23 for example? 24 A. Yes. I guess if narcotics means elicit and 25 illicit -- I am not sure of the definition 23 1 Q. What is your definition of elicit drugs? 2 A. My definition of elicit drugs is drugs that 3 are I guess sold over-the-counter, prescription drugs, 4 tobacco, acceptable in terms of society's view of them. 5 Q. Okay. And what about illicit drugs, what is 6 your definition of those? 7 A. I guess those would be relegated to society's 8 unacceptance of them, they are not marketed by the Drug 9 Administration or the FDA. 10 Q. The reason that I ask is not to say that your 11 definition is correct or incorrect, it's just so that as 12 I ask questions, we are using your definition as to the 13 terms so there is no confusion. Okay? 14 So as a case manager, did you ever work with a 15 tenant who had problems with methamphetamine? 16 A. Probably. 17 Q. Okay. Probably? 18 A. Tenants I worked with had multiple drug use 19 issues. I don't know always what they were using. 20 Q. Are you aware of, for example, what signs a 21 person may exhibit if they are using methamphetamine? 22 A. Erratic behavior. 23 Q. Such as? 24 A. I can't say with certainty. I recognize 25 someone's alcohol use more easily than other drug use. 24 1 Q. Okay. But, again, it's just what your 2 experiencing is. I am not saying it's correct or 3 incorrect. What do you, from your experience, recognize 4 as signs a person my exhibit if they are using 5 methamphetamine? 6 A. I am not sure. 7 Q. Did you ever work with tenants who told you 8 they were using methamphetamine? 9 A. I don't recall. 10 Q. What about heroin, did you ever work with 11 tenants who were using heroin? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. And how would you know that as opposed to 14 methamphetamine? 15 A. I am not really sure of the form of 16 methamphetamine. 17 I know in terms of folks that were on heroin, 18 if they were in treatment, they were going to methadone 19 clinics. And that's something I am familiar with. 20 Because in the conversations that I had with them, they 21 were telling me if they were going to the clinic for 22 dosing. 23 I'm not really sure what methamphetamine looks 24 like in it's physical nature. I don't know how it's 25 used. I guess I'm unfamiliar with that as opposed to 25 1 someone that is on heroin, that's shoots it and maybe is 2 going to dose at the clinic. That's more familiar to me 3 in my experience. 4 Q. Well, in terms of methamphetamine, have you 5 ever heard, while working as a case manager, that people 6 would smoke it? 7 A. I don't recall. 8 Q. You don't recall anyone ever telling you that? 9 A. I don't. 10 Q. Okay. What about people injecting it? Have 11 you ever heard that people inject methamphetamine? 12 A. Actually, I am not sure how it's administered. 13 I don't know what it looks like. 14 Q. I'm just asking if you've heard of it while 15 you were a case manager, like a tenant saying they were 16 snorting or they were sniffing powered methamphetamine. 17 Have you ever heard that? 18 A. I would think coke or cocaine. I'm less 19 familiar with methamphetamine. 20 MR. ELLIS: Just answer the question. 21 BY MR. WEISS: 22 Q. I am not trying to trick you. I'm just asking 23 what your knowledge is, that's all. If you tell me: 24 I've never heard of anyone ever saying they snorted or 25 sniffed powdered methamphetamine, then that's your 26 1 answer. That's all I'm asking. 2 A. Okay. 3 Q. So have you ever heard of people doing that, 4 while you worked as a case manager? 5 A. As I worked as a case manager? 6 Q. Correct. 7 A. I don't recall. 8 Q. In any of the training or education that 9 you've had regarding working with people, involving 10 housing and so on, have you ever taken any courses 11 involving substance abuse? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. What courses did you take on substance abuse? 14 A. We had the housing -- we had a clinic come in 15 and present information about mental health and 16 substance -- substances related to mental health. And 17 they spoke about the -- it was mostly mental health 18 medicine, medication, and they listed out what those 19 were. And I think they talked about dual diagnosis and 20 folks that also maintained their mental health symptoms 21 by also using illicit drugs. 22 Q. Have you ever in any of the courses that you 23 took on substance abuse covered the use of 24 methamphetamine? 25 A. I don't recall. 27 1 Q. Did you ever retain any materials from your 2 substance abuse courses that you took, any writings or 3 materials that were given in those courses? 4 A. Probably. I don't remember. 5 Q. And in all your experiencing in taking 6 substance abuse courses and working at the Tenderloin 7 Housing Clinic or any other job involving helping out 8 people that have social problems, including drug abuse, 9 have you ever heard that people would smoke 10 methamphetamine at some or another? 11 A. I don't recall. 12 Q. Isn't it true that the Tenderloin Housing 13 Clinic or THC has a policy against tenants using illegal 14 drugs? 15 A. We have a lease and house rules that all of 16 our tenants sign and information on both of those 17 documents pertain to violating local, state, and federal 18 laws. And we may include information about violence and 19 drug use in those documents. 20 Q. What information do you recall about violence 21 and drug use in those documents? 22 A. That we are -- that tenants are not to engage 23 in violent behavior and that tenants for violating local 24 and state laws can violate their lease. Some of the 25 house rules talk about -- there is 10 different things, 28 1 noise -- things that violate other people's right of 2 enjoyment. 3 Q. Right. In all your experience working at the 4 THC, have you ever known of any tenants using 5 methamphetamine on the premises? 6 A. No. 7 Q. Okay. And have you ever taken any internal -- 8 let me put it this way. Have you ever attended any sort 9 of meetings at the THC ever that covered the subject of 10 tenants using illicit drugs? 11 A. Internal training, is that what you are 12 asking? 13 Q. Or meetings? 14 A. We have trainings for our staff on issues 15 pertaining to the work that we do and trainings 16 regarding tenants' drug use would be one of those. 17 Q. And what sort of trainings have you had about 18 tenants using drugs? 19 A. Signs of drug use and responses for how to 20 work with tenants that have drug and mental health 21 issues. 22 Q. And what signs of drug use were discussed at 23 any of these meetings? 24 A. I think erratic behavior. 25 Q. And what's the definition of that, in the 29 1 context of the discussions that you had or meetings or 2 trainings? 3 A. Sure. Behavior that is abnormal and 4 escalated. 5 Q. Can you be more specific? Abnormal, I've been 6 accused of being abnormal. In the context of what your 7 trainings and meetings and discussions were, what is 8 abnormal behavior regarding the signs of drug use of a 9 tenant? 10 A. Behavior that is potentially violating the 11 lease and activity that involves one tenant yelling and 12 screaming. 13 Q. Okay. 14 A. Two tenants that are fighting. Behavior that 15 is in the hotel that could violate their lease. 16 Q. Such as? 17 A. What I just mentioned, yelling and screaming. 18 Q. Fighting? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. So were those the only signs of erratic 21 behavior you discussed or learned about at meetings in 22 the THC that might indicate drug use by a tenant? 23 A. Again, I think what we were learning is how to 24 recognize behavior that could be inappropriate for our 25 hotels and how to address at that behavior. 30 1 Q. But right now we are talking about drug use. 2 You mentioned -- and correct me if I am wrong -- that 3 one thing was signs of drug use. So we are just talking 4 about that. 5 A. Sure. When I think of drug use for our 6 tenants -- 7 MR. ELLIS: I am not sure that he finished his 8 question. Let him finish the question and just answer 9 the question. 10 MR. WEISS: Could you please read back that 11 question. 12 (Record read as follows: 13 "QUESTION: But right now we are talking about 14 drug use. You mentioned -- and correct me if I am 15 wrong -- that one thing was signs of drug use. So 16 we are just talking about that.") 17 BY MR. WEISS: 18 Q. What was discussed at these meetings, or 19 whatever, within the THC that dealt with signs of drug 20 use? 21 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Asked and answered. 22 BY MR. WEISS: 23 Q. You mentioned erratic behavior. Any other 24 signs of drug use? 25 MR. ELLIS: Asked and answered. 31 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Go ahead. You can answer. You mentioned 3 erratic behavior and fighting and yelling and screaming. 4 Anything else? 5 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Asked and answered and 6 misstates testimony. 7 BY MR. WEISS: 8 Q. Any physical characteristics of a person, was 9 that ever discussed in regards to drug use? 10 MR. ELLIS: Asked and answered. Misstates 11 testimony. 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. You can go ahead. 14 A. I'm not sure what to do. 15 MR. ELLIS: I am not telling you not to 16 answer. He is asking you a question if there is 17 physical signs of drug use. 18 MR. WEISS: Right. 19 MR. ELLIS: What I'm saying is, you've already 20 answered that part and he has already asked that 21 question so I'm putting objections on the record, but I 22 am not instructing you not to answer. So if you have 23 anything else in addition to what you said testify to 24 it. 25 32 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Right. That thing he said, can you answer 3 that? 4 A. Other signs of drug use? 5 Q. Right. Other than what you have already told 6 me. 7 MR. ELLIS: And the same objections on the 8 record. Misstates the testimony. Asked and answered. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. Go ahead. 11 A. Tenants that nod off, fall asleep. 12 Q. Okay. Anything else that you can think of? 13 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 14 THE WITNESS: Not that I can remember. 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. How many meetings do you think you have 17 attended at the THC where issues of tenant drug use were 18 discussed? 19 A. An estimate would be five. 20 Q. Okay. And who attend these meetings 21 typically? 22 A. I guess the way I -- I don't see them as 23 meetings. 24 Q. Okay. 25 A. In my experiencing, we have trainings in 33 1 general topics, not about specific tenants -- that would 2 be confidential. 3 Q. Right. 4 A. So we have had trainings on issues pertaining 5 to providing supportive housing. And we had, as case 6 managers, meetings within the case management 7 department. Where if we presented information about a 8 tenant specifically, it would be confidential and it was 9 a case conference to learn how to work with that person 10 and provide resources for their case. 11 Q. And in that context, who would be present at 12 such a meeting? 13 A. At a case conference? 14 Q. Correct. 15 A. It would be the director, the supervisors, and 16 the case managers and some social workers. 17 Q. So when you are saying director, who is that? 18 A. The Director of Support Services. 19 Q. And who else? Director of Support Services 20 and the -- 21 A. The case managers and the case managers 22 supervisors. 23 MR. ELLIS: Let him finish so the record is 24 clear. 25 34 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Have you ever attended such a meeting 3 involving Chanel Samuel? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Now, in any of your trainings, as you call 6 them, have you ever covered the subject of tenant 7 violence? 8 A. We've had trainings on deescalation. 9 Q. What is deescalation? 10 A. It is how to respond to an activity that needs 11 to be deescalated. It could be a verbal argument and 12 how to intervene and take steps to deescalate that 13 situation. 14 Q. Have you ever had such a meeting involving 15 Mydra McGarr? 16 A. No. 17 Q. How about Chanel Samuel? 18 A. No. 19 MR. ELLIS: I am going to object after the 20 fact. No, I'm sorry. It's vague as to what kind of 21 meeting, if we are still talking about case conferences 22 or deescalation meetings specifically. 23 BY MR. WEISS: 24 Q. I'm referring now to deescalation kind of 25 situations. You've never had such a meeting involving 35 1 either Mydra McGarr or Chanel Samuel? 2 MR. ELLIS: Still object. Vague as to what 3 kind of meeting. 4 MR. WEISS: A deescalation meeting. 5 MR. ELLIS: Specifically a deescalation 6 meeting? 7 MR. WEISS: Right. 8 THE WITNESS: And we were discussing trainings 9 and meetings. 10 BY MR. WEISS: 11 Q. Right. 12 A. Examples of meetings that I gave were case 13 conferences regarding tenants. And as a case manager, 14 no. Again, that would have been confidential 15 information about a tenant that was being discussed. 16 Q. Right. But what about any such meeting in any 17 position you've ever held at THC involving either Mydra 18 McGarr or Chanel Samuel, have you ever had any meetings 19 regarding that? 20 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague as to what kind 21 of meetings. 22 MR. WEISS: The ones that she described, the 23 case manager meeting or deescalation meeting. 24 MR. ELLIS: As opposed to just a discussion 25 with another employee? 36 1 MR. WEISS: Correct. 2 THE WITNESS: No. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. Have you ever had a discussion with another 5 employee about either Mydra McGarr and Chanel Samuel 6 concerning the issue of deescalation? 7 A. I spoke with my supervisor on Thursday the 8 29th about a report I received that there was a verbal 9 disagreement between Chanel and Mydra. 10 Q. Would that be Mr. Holland that you are talking 11 about? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Let me ask you this. If you were a case 14 manager and you witnessed a heated verbal altercation 15 between two tenants such that you wanted to have a 16 deescalation meeting, would you report it to a 17 supervisor? 18 MR. ELLIS: You are asking her -- not policies 19 and procedures -- her own experiencing as a case 20 manager? 21 BY MR. WEISS: 22 Q. Right. 23 A. Can I repeat back to you to make sure I 24 understand the question? 25 Q. Sure. 37 1 A. You are asking my experiencing as a case 2 manager if I saw two tenants having a heated argument? 3 Q. Correct. 4 A. If I would then have a deescalation meeting 5 with both of them? 6 Q. No. If you would report the altercation, the 7 verbal altercation to your supervisor? 8 A. Okay. Are you asking is that the first thing 9 I would do? 10 Q. No. Just would you do it at all? 11 A. I think it depends. 12 Q. On what? 13 A. On the circumstances of the situation. How 14 heated is that argument? Is it tenants cussing at each 15 other in the lobby during food pantry because the food 16 pantry line is taking a long time? So that's kind of 17 standard so we would react immediately to that situation 18 and resolve that. 19 What I would pass on to my supervisor is 20 something that I would have concern of. And I would 21 meet with my supervisor once a week as a case manager 22 and go through tenant issues, building issues, rent 23 issues, behavioral issues. That is something that I 24 would communicate to my supervisor. 25 Q. What caused to you to communicate with Mr. 38 1 Holland about some verbal altercation between Mydra 2 McGarr and Chanel Samuel? 3 A. Because I received information from one 4 employee about an incident happening the day before -- 5 or earlier that day. And when that occurred, I met with 6 that person. 7 Q. Who was that person? 8 A. That was Mydra. And part of what I did is 9 spoke to my supervisor later that day or the next 10 morning, I don't remember at this point when that was, 11 to communicate what information I was given and what we 12 needed to do to follow up. 13 Q. What information were you given? 14 A. That Mydra was working behind the front desk 15 at the Hartland Hotel and that Chanel came into the 16 front desk area, got some water, they had a 17 disagreement, Chanel slammed the door and walked out. 18 And tenants were present when the door slammed at the 19 front desk. 20 Q. And that's all the information that you 21 received? 22 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague as to time. 23 BY MR. WEISS: 24 Q. At the time that you communicated to 25 Mr. Holland, was that all the information that you had 39 1 received? 2 A. I recall speaking with him after I received 3 that report. 4 Q. What was your discussion with Mr. Holland 5 about that report? 6 A. That we also needed to talk to the other party 7 involved, Chanel. 8 Q. And why did you say that? 9 A. To me it seemed like investigating to find out 10 both party's sides of what took place and starting that 11 process by speaking to both individually. 12 Q. Were you worried that the situation could 13 erupt into violence? 14 A. No. I did not think that this situation would 15 erupt into violence. 16 Q. What employee communicated to you about this 17 front desk issue? Or, I'm sorry, about the issue of 18 Chanel coming behind the desk to get water? 19 A. What employee? 20 Q. Yes. 21 A. Mydra. 22 Q. Did you ever hear from Mr. Lopez about this? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And what did Mr. Lopez tell you? 25 A. He said that there was a verbal altercation 40 1 between Mydra and Chanel earlier that day. 2 Q. Okay. 3 A. And then at the end of that day, about 4:55, 4 he said there was a second verbal altercation between 5 Chanel and Mydra. 6 Q. Did he indicate the nature of the altercations 7 to you? 8 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. Well, what did he tell you about these 11 altercations? 12 A. That they happened at the front desk. 13 Q. That's it? 14 A. I don't know that he knew content of the 15 conversation. That there was a report that they had two 16 verbal disagreements at the front desk area. 17 Q. That's all Mr. Lopez told you? 18 A. I don't recall other information that he 19 shared with me. 20 Q. Did he ever send you e-mails about it? 21 A. Yes. I replied to him by e-mail, I think, 22 later that day saying that I received the report and 23 that we would need to follow up on it. 24 Q. Now, were there any writings by Mr. McGarr 25 about these two altercations? 41 1 A. Yes. There were two incident reports. 2 Q. Did you ever see those before you communicated 3 with Mr. Holland? 4 A. I saw those. I don't recall if I saw those on 5 Thursday or Friday morning. 6 Q. Okay. Did you ever discuss with Mr. Holland 7 any issues regarding Chanel Samuel before May 29, 2008? 8 A. Can you repeat that? 9 Q. Did you ever discuss with Mr. Holland any 10 issues regarding Chanel Samuel before May 29, 2008? 11 A. Any issues? I was her supervisor and I talked 12 with him about scheduling and where she was working 13 throughout the week. I remember discussing with him 14 that she needed eyeglasses and she was getting them. 15 Q. Anything else? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Now, did you ever handle rentals to tenants? 18 A. Rentals? 19 Q. Yes. 20 A. Directly? 21 Q. Yes. 22 A. No. 23 Q. Typically what kind of tenants live at the 24 Hartland Hotel? 25 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague. 42 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. You can answer it. 3 A. THC houses formerly homeless people. We have 4 inherited tenants that lived in the hotels prior to us 5 taking over management of the hotels. We -- the way I 6 describe it, the people living in our hotels are 7 veterans, are working poor people, are low income, and 8 on SSI and GA. 9 Q. Are tenants -- when a tenant is seeking to 10 live at the Hartland Hotel, for example, are they given 11 any information telling them they are not allowed to use 12 illicit drugs on the premises? 13 A. We have a lease and house rules that goes 14 along with that. They sign a lot of paperwork when they 15 move in, it's standard for every tenant. I'm fairly 16 certain there is paperwork in there pertaining to 17 drug-free environments. 18 Q. As a case manager, did you ever have to deal 19 with an tenant who is using illicit drugs on the 20 premises? 21 A. Sure. The tenants I worked with? 22 Q. Yes. 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And how did you become aware that the tenants 25 were using illicit drugs on the premises when you were a 43 1 case manager? 2 A. Some tenants self disclose. Some police come 3 and take tenants to jail. 4 Q. Okay. But the police, do they come to take 5 tenants to jail because they are using illicit drugs on 6 the premises? 7 A. On occasion. If there is a report that police 8 are responding to, they may find drugs in the unit. I 9 mean, I can think of one situation where that occurred 10 at the Mission Hotel where I worked. 11 Q. And you mentioned self disclosure. Would that 12 be a situation where a tenant would come to you and say: 13 I am having problems with drugs, help me? 14 A. On occasion, that would be an example. 15 Q. What other kind of self disclosure would there 16 by a tenant of illicit drug use on the premises? 17 A. Suspecting their neighbor is selling drugs out 18 of their unit. 19 Q. And if a tenant came to you and said: I 20 suspect another tenants is selling drugs out of the 21 unit, what would you do as a case manager? 22 A. As a case manager? I might speak to the 23 property manager and do they know, this is a complaint a 24 tenant has. 25 Q. Okay. Anything else? 44 1 A. If that tenant was on my case list, I might 2 keep that in mind in terms of working with that tenant, 3 outreaching them, seeing if there is any services that 4 they need. Is their rent paid on time? 5 Q. As a case manager, aside from the two things 6 that you just mentioned, were there any other ways that 7 you became aware that tenants were using illicit drugs 8 on the premises? 9 A. If there were incident reports or written 10 violations that I received from property management as a 11 case manager? 12 Q. However it was received by you. 13 A. Well, as a case manager, the property manager 14 gives the case manager a copy of incident reports, 15 written violations that take place in the hotel, so the 16 case manager can follow up as needed on those 17 situations. 18 Q. What's the position that you're holding now at 19 the Hartland? 20 A. I don't work at the Hartland. My office is 21 separate. I am in property management. So I am a lead 22 property supervisor. 23 Q. So as lead property supervisor, does your job 24 encompass more than just the Hartland Hotel? Does it 25 include other properties as well? 45 1 A. Yes. It does. 2 Q. How many other properties? 3 A. Currently, three other properties. 4 Q. What are they? 5 A. The Caldrake, the Looper, and the Union Hotel. 6 Q. And in your job as the lead property 7 supervisor, have you received reports from case managers 8 that tenants are using illicit drugs on the premises? 9 A. Not from case managers. 10 Q. As lead property supervisor, how have you ever 11 received information that a tenant is using illicit 12 drugs on the premises? 13 A. Verbally from my general manager that I 14 supervise. 15 Q. Now, if a general manager learns that a tenant 16 is using illicit drugs on the premises, do you know 17 whether that general manager is supposed to report it 18 back to you? 19 A. If the general manager has knowledge that 20 there is drug use that's illicit, yes, they should 21 report it to me. 22 Q. It should be? So it's required if the person 23 learns of it? 24 A. I think they need to follow up on those 25 reports as appropriate. I think one of the things, that 46 1 includes speaking during supervision, again about 2 behavioral, building related issues, tenant issues, and 3 that would come up in discussion. 4 Q. What if a general manager learns that a person 5 is smoking methamphetamine in their unit, is that 6 something that should be reported to the lead property 7 supervisor? 8 A. Well, at Tenderloin Housing Clinic, we are not 9 a clean and sober living environment. Tenants do not 10 have, as part of their lease, that they must be at all 11 times drug-free. We approach tenant use from a harm 12 reduction philosophy. It's not an abstinence model. We 13 are contracted with the City as a non-profit. 14 San Francisco is harm reduction based, not abstinence 15 based. 16 If there is drug use going on inside a unit 17 that we are aware of, the approach is harm reduction, to 18 help that person manage their day-to-day living, 19 including maintaining their housing. 20 If that violates the lease and the quiet 21 enjoyment of other tenants, if it interferes with the 22 lease and the house rules, we follow up on those 23 instances by figuring out what we know. 24 And is it seen outside of their unit? We only 25 go into their units for pest control or 24 hour notice. 47 1 We don't just go into the unit. So if we see the drug 2 use, we are going to need to follow up with the tenant 3 specifically. And, also, as needed, issue written 4 violations; as needed, perform evictions; as needed, 5 contact the police. 6 MR. ELLIS: Can we take five minutes? 7 MR. WEISS: Absolutely. 8 (Off the record.) 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. We are all ready. So in regards to your 11 answer there -- 12 MR. ELLIS: Move to strike as non-responsive, 13 after the fact. 14 MR. WEISS: Denied. Okay. In order to make 15 things go easier with law and motion and everything 16 else, I just rule on the objections myself. It makes it 17 go faster. 18 Q. My question was, what should a general manager 19 do if he witnesses -- strike that. Should a general 20 manager report illicit drug use by a tenant if he 21 witnesses it on the premises? 22 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 23 hypothetical. 24 BY MR. WEISS: 25 Q. Yes or no? 48 1 A. If he witnesses it on the premises? 2 Q. Right. 3 A. It depends on whether -- if he witnesses it 4 with someone with a marijuana medicinal card and that 5 person is potentially under the influence of marijuana, 6 that is something that he may not report. He may report 7 it to his supervisor if there is a unit that for 8 multiple days has been in and out traffic, lots of 9 visitors, lots of noise, and then that may be an example 10 of when he would report it to a supervisor. 11 Q. I don't mean by name. What's the next step up 12 from general manager? 13 A. Property supervisor. 14 Q. Is that different than lead property 15 supervisor? 16 A. There is three property supervisors. I am one 17 of those. My position is between the director of 18 property manager -- management and the two property 19 supervisors. So when the director of property 20 manager -- management is out, I assume his role. 21 Q. So let's make it real clear. Suppose a 22 general manager has actual personal knowledge of a 23 tenant smoking methamphetamine on the premises. Is that 24 something that should be reported to the lead -- or to 25 the property supervisor? 49 1 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 2 hypothetical. 3 THE WITNESS: So -- 4 MR. ELLIS: Read back the question and try to 5 answer the question. 6 (Record read as follows: 7 "QUESTION: So let's make it real clear. 8 Suppose a general manager has actual personal 9 knowledge of a tenant smoking methamphetamine on 10 the premises. Is that something that should be 11 reported to the lead -- or to the property 12 supervisor?") 13 THE WITNESS: Has actual knowledge of someone 14 smoking methamphetamines? 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. On the premises. 17 A. It depends. If it's in someone's unit? 18 Q. Yes. 19 A. And actual knowledge being -- it's been 20 reported? I guess I am not sure what actual knowledge 21 means. 22 Q. Personal knowledge, right there, smells the 23 smoke from methamphetamine, knows that the person is 24 smoking it. 25 A. Okay. 50 1 Q. Is that something that the general manager 2 should report to the lead property supervisor or any 3 supervisor for that matter? 4 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 5 hypothetical. 6 BY MR. WEISS: 7 Q. Your answer? 8 A. So that general manager should address that 9 situation as they encounter it. 10 Q. My question is, though, should it be reported 11 to a property supervisor? Yes or no? Do you know the 12 answer to that? 13 MR. ELLIS: Or do you know? 14 THE WITNESS: I think -- I think it depends. 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. All right. Go ahead. 17 A. I think it depends on what took place. If 18 it's someone in their unit smoking, we, as property 19 management, can't go into someone's unit and witness 20 that. If it's behind closed doors, then it depends -- 21 they may -- they are not obligated to report those 22 things. 23 Q. Why is that? 24 A. We are not a clean and sober living 25 environment. People are not obligated to be drug-free 51 1 to live in supportive housing. 2 Q. Is it the policy of the THC that people can 3 smoke methamphetamine in their units? 4 A. We do not encourage that, no. 5 Q. Doesn't it say on the lease that drug use, 6 illicit drug use on the premises is grounds for 7 eviction? 8 MR. ELLIS: Objection. The document speaks 9 for itself. Incomplete hypothetical. 10 BY MR. WEISS: 11 Q. You can answer. 12 MR. ELLIS: Does the lease specifically say 13 that? 14 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. Did you ever see the lease that Chanel Samuel 17 signed, for example? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Have you ever seen any leases that any tenant 20 has signed to live in the Hartland Hotel? 21 A. No. Not -- I know we use the same lease at 22 all of our sites. I have not looked at the Hartland 23 tenants leases. 24 Q. Have you looked at any tenant leases at all at 25 the THC in the last five years? 52 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Is there a provision on those leases that 3 prohibits illicit drug use on the premises? 4 A. I don't know what it says. 5 Q. Have you ever heard in any of your employment 6 at the THC that a tenant has been evicted for illicit 7 drug use on the premises? 8 A. I don't know. 9 Q. Now, when a tenant applies to live at a THC 10 property, is that tenant informed that illicit drug use 11 on the premises is not allowed? 12 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 13 Vague and ambiguous. Incomplete hypothetical. 14 THE WITNESS: They sign the same lease 15 documents that other tenants sign, along with the house 16 rules. I don't know the specifics. 17 BY MR. WEISS: 18 Q. Are you required to know the specifics of that 19 as a lead property supervisor? 20 A. I work -- no. 21 Q. Let me ask you something about employees. Are 22 the employees allowed to use illicit drugs on the 23 premises? 24 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague and ambiguous. 25 Calls for speculation. Incomplete hypothetical. 53 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. You can answer. 3 A. Can you read that question. 4 (Record read as follows: 5 "QUESTION: Let me ask you something about 6 employees. Are the employees allowed to use 7 illicit drugs on the premises?") 8 THE WITNESS: No. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. How do you know that? 11 A. We have an alcohol- and drug-free workplace 12 policy. 13 Q. How do you know that? Did you read a 14 document? Did someone tell you? 15 A. We have a policy written on that. 16 Q. Have you ever seen that policy? 17 A. I have. 18 Q. Now, is it true that in some circumstances you 19 have some people who are tenants that are also employees 20 of the THC? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Now, if a person was an employee of the THC 23 and also a tenant, would that person be subject to 24 discipline for using illicit drugs on the premises, 25 i.e., smoking methamphetamine? 54 1 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 2 hypothetical. Calls for speculation. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. You can answer. 5 MR. ELLIS: Vague and ambiguous. 6 THE WITNESS: I apologize. Can you read back 7 the question. 8 (Record read as follows: 9 "QUESTION: Now, if a person was an employee of 10 the THC and also a tenant, would that person be 11 subject to discipline for using illicit drugs on 12 the premises, i.e., smoking methamphetamine?") 13 THE WITNESS: Would they be subject to 14 discipline? 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. Correct. 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. How do you know that? 19 A. We have a lease and we have house rules. If 20 that violates the lease and house rules, then there 21 would be follow up, as appropriate, that could be lease 22 violations. 23 Q. What kind of follow up are you talking about? 24 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 25 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. 55 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Go ahead. 3 A. If there is behavior that violates the lease, 4 we do investigations based on an incident report. And 5 based on the outcome of that investigation, one decision 6 might be to write a violation to the tenant that they 7 have violated the lease. Depending on the 8 circumstances, a written violation might be appropriate, 9 a housing retention conference, eviction sometimes is 10 appropriate. 11 Q. So that's if the employee is using illicit 12 drugs on the premises? 13 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Asked and answered. 14 THE WITNESS: I thought you meant a tenant. 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. All right. Well, let's refer to the person 17 who has a dual role, so to speak, tenant and employee. 18 If the employee was also a tenant and it was known that 19 the employee/tenant was using methamphetamine on the 20 premises, would that person be subject to eviction? 21 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 22 hypothetical. 23 THE WITNESS: If behavior violated the lease, 24 one outcome might be eviction. 25 56 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. And what would be the outcome insofar as the 3 person being an employee? 4 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 5 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. 6 THE WITNESS: If their behavior violated the 7 policy and procedures of their employer, then 8 progressive discipline -- investigation first. 9 Depending on the outcome of the investigation, 10 progressive discipline are the steps that we take in 11 reprimanding employees. 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. Does the THC have a policy of allowing 14 employees to use illicit drugs on the premises? 15 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Argumentative. Asked 16 and answered. Incomplete hypothetical. 17 Do you have a policy? Read back the question, 18 please. 19 (Record read as follows: 20 "QUESTION: Does the THC have a policy of 21 allowing employees to use illicit drugs on the 22 premises?") 23 THE WITNESS: No, to allow. We do not have a 24 policy that allows to use illicit drugs on the premises. 25 57 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Okay. I am going to have this marked as 3 Plaintiff's 2 and then I am going to hand it to you to 4 take a look at. It's four pages entitled Rental 5 Agreement, Looper Residence, Tenderloin Housing Clinic 6 House Rules. 7 (Rental Agreement, Looper Residence, and House Rules 8 marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 2 for identification.) 9 10 BY MR. WEISS: 11 Q. You can take a look at that. Have you had a 12 chance to look at that? 13 A. I did. 14 Q. I'll represent to you that this is a rental 15 agreement that Chanel Samuel had with the THC which 16 incorporated the Tenderloin Housing Clinic House Rules. 17 We received this in discovery. 18 And on the house rules, please turn your 19 attention to number 5. Are you looking at that? 20 A. I am. 21 Q. And it says, "Absolutely no use or possession 22 of illegal drugs in the hotel or premises." 23 Now, did you know prior to seeing this that 24 that was the case with a tenant agreement? 25 MR. ELLIS: Objection. It's vague. Are you 58 1 asking if she knew that that was written on this 2 document? 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. No. Well, let me ask you this. Did you know 5 that as a condition of renting a unit at a THC property, 6 the tenant had to sign a copy of the house rules? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Did you know that the house rules, which are 9 in Plaintiff's 2, for example, state "Absolutely no use 10 or possession of illegal drugs in the hotel or 11 premises"? 12 MR. ELLIS: Did you know that that said that 13 word for word? 14 THE WITNESS: No. 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. So prior to this very minute when I showed it 17 to you, you had no knowledge of this at all? 18 A. That that number five was worded in that 19 way -- 20 Q. No. Let's not get tricky here. Okay? I am 21 asking you if prior to this very moment when I showed it 22 to you, you had no knowledge that the house rules were: 23 Absolutely no use or possession of illegal drugs on the 24 hotel or premises? 25 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague and ambiguous. 59 1 Misstates the testimony. It's an incomplete 2 hypothetical. 3 If you are asking about this particular line, 4 that's one thing. She has talked about, for example, 5 the medical marijuana cards. I don't know that the 6 effect of this line written on this page is the same as 7 THC's policies and procedures. So I am not clear if you 8 are asking about this particular line on this sheet, 9 Exhibit 2, or if you are asking about THC's policies and 10 procedures. 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. Well, isn't it true you knew that as a 13 condition of the rental agreement, that the tenant also 14 had to initial a copy of the THC house rules? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. You knew that. Right? 17 A. Yes, they initial the house rules. 18 Q. And did you know that in the house rules was a 19 provision that stated: Absolutely no use or possession 20 of illegal drugs on the hotel or premises? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Until this very moment, you didn't know? 23 A. That it stated this? 24 Q. Correct. 25 A. I knew the house rules -- 60 1 MR. ELLIS: Did you know that this was stated 2 on the sheet? 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. Yes or no? 5 A. No. 6 Q. In all your training and work at the 7 Tenderloin Housing Clinic, until this very moment, you 8 had no idea that the house rules had a provision that 9 stated: Absolutely no use or possession of illegal drug 10 in the hotel or premises? 11 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Asked and answered. 12 Incomplete hypothetical. Calls for speculation. Are 13 you asking about the rules of THC or this particular 14 sheet that she has already responded to? You just asked 15 if she knew this was on here and then you reworded the 16 question. So that to me says that you are asking for 17 something above and beyond what's written in the house 18 rules and that's why I'm confused by the question. I 19 really don't know if you are asking about this or 20 something bigger. 21 MR. WEISS: Could you please read the question 22 back. 23 (Record read as follows: 24 "QUESTION: In all your training and work at 25 the Tenderloin Housing Clinic, until this very 61 1 moment, you had no idea that the house rules had a 2 provision that stated: Absolutely no use or 3 possession of illegal drug in the hotel or 4 premises?") 5 MR. ELLIS: I am going to instruct her not to 6 answer because I don't understand the question. And the 7 reason I don't understand the question is because you 8 are referencing her training and experiencing, which to 9 me says you are asking about something different than 10 what's written on the paper. So I don't understand what 11 basis of information you want to her to respond to. 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. Did you understand the question? 14 A. No. 15 MR. ELLIS: I'm instructing her not to answer. 16 MR. WEISS: What's the basis for it? 17 MR. ELLIS: If you are asking her what's 18 written on this page or if you are asking her what her 19 training and experience is regarding rules of the THC. 20 I don't understand what you are asking about. 21 MR. WEISS: Let me see if I can clarify it. 22 Although I don't agree with your objection. But I don't 23 want to argue on the record. 24 Q. So I've shown you an exhibit, which includes 25 the house rules. The exhibit has a provision that there 62 1 is absolutely no use or possession of illegal drugs on 2 the hotel or premises allowed. I am asking if in all of 3 your training and experiencing at the Tenderloin Housing 4 Clinic, did you ever hear of this provision prior to 5 seeing it today on this document? 6 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Misstates testimony. 7 Vague and ambiguous. Incomplete hypothetical. And I 8 don't understand the question. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. Go ahead and answer. 11 A. I'm confused. 12 MR. ELLIS: Okay. That's fine. Then don't 13 answer it. 14 BY MR. WEISS: 15 Q. I don't think you are confused, but let's do 16 this again. 17 MR. ELLIS: Can I interject something? You've 18 already asked her if she knew that this number five was 19 written on here. She answered that. So then you are 20 now asking something about her training and experience 21 as it applies to THC's policies and procedures? You are 22 asking about something different than this page is what 23 I believe you are asking. 24 MR. WEISS: No. 25 MR. ELLIS: Then she's already answered that 63 1 if she knew that that line was on there. She's already 2 answered the question. 3 MR. WEISS: That she did know it was on there? 4 MR. ELLIS: She already answered the question 5 of whether or not she knew that that line was written on 6 there. She's already answered that. 7 BY MR. WEISS: 8 Q. And your answer was, No. Correct? 9 A. As you asked it, if I knew that that number 10 five was listed as you read it on the house rules? 11 Q. Right. 12 A. My answer was No. 13 MR. WEISS: Okay. Let's mark this as 14 Plaintiff's 3, and after you mark it, hand it to the 15 witness. 16 (Drug and Alcohol Use Policy marked Plaintiff's 17 Exhibit No. 3 for identification.) 18 19 BY MR. WEISS: 20 Q. Take a look at that. 21 A. Okay. 22 Q. Now, prior to me handing you this document, 23 which is Plaintiff's 3, entitled Drug and alcohol use 24 policy, have you ever seen this before today? 25 A. I think an updated version of this. 64 1 Q. Well, this one is signed 3/14/08. 2 A. Okay. 3 Q. And you have seen an updated version of this 4 since this date? 5 A. I don't recall. I know we have a drug and 6 alcohol use policy, this may be the one that I have 7 seen. 8 Q. Well, this one -- 9 A. It's just old, the typing. 10 Q. I'll represent to you that this document was 11 received in discovery responses from the THC and it's 12 signed by Chanel Samuel and it looks like it's dated 13 3/14/08. 14 A. Okay. 15 Q. Now, prior to 3/14/08, have you ever seen a 16 document entitled Drug and Alcohol Use Policy? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Okay. And was it any different than the one 19 that you're looking at in Plaintiff's 3? 20 A. I don't think so. 21 Q. Did you ever know, prior to today, whether 22 there is a policy of the THC to forbid distribution, 23 sales, or purchase of any illegal or controlled 24 substance while on the job? 25 A. Yes. 65 1 Q. How did you become aware of that? 2 A. Through familiarity with policies and 3 procedures including this one. 4 MR. WEISS: Let's mark this as Plaintiff's 4. 5 And after you mark it, please hand it to her. 6 (Off the record.) 7 (Rental Agreement, Hartland Hotel, and House 8 Rules marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 4 for 9 identification.) 10 BY MR. WEISS: 11 Q. Please take a look at that. Now, I'll 12 represent to you that Plaintiff's 4 is a Rental 13 Agreement for the Hartland Hotel signed by Chanel Samuel 14 and it incorporates the Tenderloin Housing Clinic House 15 Rules which is also part of the exhibit also signed by 16 Chanel Samuel given to us in the discovery responses. 17 Prior to today, have you ever seen these documents? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Okay. Now, if there were an issue of employee 20 drug use on the premises, is that something that would 21 be handled by human resources as opposed to a property 22 supervisor? 23 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 24 hypothetical. 25 THE WITNESS: I believe both would be 66 1 involved. 2 BY MR. WEISS: 3 Q. Why is that? 4 A. We consult with HR regarding employee matters. 5 Q. When you say "we", you mean property 6 supervisors? 7 A. Management. 8 Q. Does that include property supervisors? 9 A. Sure. Yes. 10 Q. Have you ever met Chanel Samuel before? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And when was the first time you met her? 13 A. An estimate would be when she was a desk clerk 14 at the Raymond Hotel. 15 Q. At the what hotel? 16 A. Raymond Hotel. 17 Q. How was it that you met her when she worked 18 there? 19 A. She was a desk clerk. 20 Q. Right. 21 A. And I supervised the case manager at the 22 Raymond Hotel. I visited the case manager ones a week 23 for supervision. 24 Q. Approximately what month and year was that? 25 A. It would have been between May of '06 and, I'm 67 1 guessing, a year, somewhere -- from May '06 going 2 forward a year. 3 Q. Were you ever aware whether Ms. Samuel was 4 terminated from her employment at the Tenderloin Housing 5 Clinic prior to the termination involving the 6 altercation or the assault on Mydra McGarr? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Do employees at the Tenderloin Housing Clinic 9 have to go through a probationary period? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Do you know if that's 90 days? 12 A. It is. 13 Q. Do you know whether Chanel Samuel's father, 14 Bryan Samuel, ever worked for the THC? 15 A. He did. 16 Q. And what was his job? 17 A. He worked at the Jefferson. I'm not sure what 18 his title was. 19 Q. Do you know whether Chanel Samuel lived at the 20 Jefferson when her father worked at the Jefferson? 21 A. I believe so. I am not certain. 22 Q. Okay. Now, you mentioned you met Chanel 23 Samuel for the first time when she worked as a desk 24 clerk at the Raymond Hotel. Are you aware of other 25 properties Ms. Samuel worked at the THC in addition to 68 1 the Raymond Hotel? 2 A. As a desk clerk? 3 Q. In any position. 4 A. As a floating janitor, yes. 5 Q. And that would be at which hotel? 6 A. I recall her working at the All Star, the 7 Raymond. She worked -- Well, she was a floating janitor 8 so she was sent out to various hotels. Those are the 9 two that I recall frequently. 10 She helped one day at Hartland, I believe, or 11 a couple of days, regarding a dumpster. 12 She may have worked at the Pierre. I don't 13 know with certainty what other hotel. 14 Q. Now, at the Hartland Hotel, do you know how 15 many days she actually worked there doing whatever? 16 A. I think it was only related to a dumpster, to 17 help load the dumpster. 18 Q. Help what? 19 A. Help load the equipment into the dumpster. 20 Q. Now, this area where the assault occurred, do 21 you know where that is in the Hartland Hotel? 22 A. The assault? 23 Q. By Ms. Samuel on Ms. McGarr. 24 A. Yes. In the basement. 25 Q. Is that basement locked off to tenants? 69 1 A. When the assault occurred? No. 2 MR. ELLIS: The alleged assault. Objection. 3 Incomplete hypothetical. Misstates testimony. I am 4 just not conceding that there was an assault by 5 Ms. Samuel on Ms. McGarr. 6 BY MR. WEISS: 7 Q. I understand. So the alleged assault occurred 8 in the basement. Correct? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. And how does one get into that -- on May 30, 11 2008, how would one get into the basement of the 12 Hartland Hotel? 13 A. There is an entrance from the lobby. There is 14 a back door in the alleyway. I think those are the two 15 doorways in and out of the basement. 16 Q. Is there an elevator that goes down there? 17 A. There is. 18 Q. Does the elevator require a key to turn it on 19 or off to take it to the basement? 20 A. Yes. It's a key entry for the basement. 21 Q. On May 30, 2008, do you know whether the back 22 door to the alley was locked? 23 A. It remains locked at all times. 24 Q. But the door from the lobby to the basement on 25 May 30, 2008, was not locked? 70 1 A. Correct. 2 Q. How do you know that? 3 A. We did not lock the basement door at that 4 time. 5 Q. How do you know that is my question? 6 A. I don't think there was a lock on that door. 7 Q. Do you know how Ms. Samuel went into the 8 basement at the date and time of the alleged assault? 9 A. I don't. 10 Q. Do you know whether Ms. Samuel, on the date 11 and time of the assault, had keys to the elevator? 12 A. She was not an employee of the Hartland. 13 MR. ELLIS: Do you know if she had keys to the 14 elevator? 15 THE WITNESS: I don't. 16 BY MR. WEISS: 17 Q. If she was not an employee of the 18 Hartland -- strike that. When you say not an employee 19 of the Hartland, what do you mean? That wasn't usually 20 the premises that she worked on? 21 A. Correct. 22 Q. But she was an employee of THC on May 30, 23 wasn't she, May 30, 2008? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Now, this elevator that goes to the basement 71 1 of the Hartland, does it also go to other floors of the 2 Hartland? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Does it require a key to make the elevator go 5 into the basement? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. How do you know? 8 A. I have been told that. 9 Q. What? 10 A. I have been told that. 11 Q. Okay. Who told you? 12 A. Maintenance. 13 Q. Do you have a name? 14 A. I believe it's the maintenance manager for the 15 Hartland that said there is a key that one uses to take 16 the elevator down to the basement. 17 Q. Do you have a name for that person? 18 A. Dan Smith. 19 Q. When did you learn that from Mr. Smith, before 20 or after the alleged assault? 21 A. I don't recall. 22 Q. Now, did you take part in any investigation of 23 the incident of May 30 -- strike that. Let's make it 24 clear. 25 Did you have any knowledge about the use of a 72 1 key to take the elevator to the basement of the Hartland 2 Hotel prior to May 30, 2008? 3 A. I think so. That's, I think, standard for our 4 elevators in buildings that have basements. 5 Q. And how many people would typically have 6 access to the keys to the elevator that would be taken 7 to the basement of the Hartland Hotel? 8 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 9 Incomplete hypothetical. 10 BY MR. WEISS: 11 Q. Only if you know. 12 A. I'm not sure. 13 Q. Well, Dan Smith, how was it that he came to 14 tell you that it takes keys to take the elevator to the 15 basement of the Hartland? 16 A. We have a facilities meeting every other week. 17 We go over building-related issues regarding 18 maintenance. I recall hearing that our elevators that 19 go into basements specifically have a key to go into the 20 basement. 21 Q. Was there any investigation of the alleged 22 assault of May 30, 2008, by the THC? 23 A. Was there an investigation of the alleged 24 assault on the 30th? 25 Q. Correct. 73 1 A. Yes. We responded to the call we received 2 that an incident had occurred. 3 Q. What call did you receive? 4 A. That Chanel had struck Mydra in the face with 5 a pipe. 6 Q. And how did you learn that? 7 A. By phone call. 8 Q. From who? 9 A. Jesus, the general manager. 10 Q. And where were you when you received this 11 call? 12 A. In a meeting at 449 Turk. 13 Q. And what time of day did you receive the call? 14 A. An estimate would be 11:30 a.m. 15 Q. Was this call reported to you as an emergency? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. What did Mr. Lopez tell you in this phone 18 call? 19 A. That he received a call from his desk clerk, 20 that this incident had just occurred at the hotel. 21 Jesus was off-site and gave me that information. And I 22 immediately told my supervisor, who was in the same 23 meeting, and I went up to the hotel. 24 Q. And why didn't Mr. Holland go up to the hotel? 25 A. He -- I don't know with certainty why he 74 1 didn't leave when I did. We were in a meeting and he 2 came up soon after I arrived at the hotel. 3 Q. When you got to the hotel, what did you do? 4 A. I went into the lobby and spoke with, I 5 believe it was, James, the desk clerk, saw people in the 6 lobby, heard that it happened down in the basement and 7 that the emergency personnel were downstairs. And then 8 I went through the lobby to the basement door, it was 9 open, I proceeded to go down the hallway of the basement 10 stairwell and I saw where the emergency personnel were 11 with Mydra, tending to her at that point. 12 Q. Did you see blood on the floor? 13 A. I saw Mydra on the floor with her head near 14 the stairs and I think I saw blood around her head. 15 Q. On the floor? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Did you see blood on the walls at all? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Did you see this pipe that was used in the 20 alleged assault? 21 A. No. 22 Q. What was Mydra's condition when you saw her on 23 the floor with the emergency personnel? 24 A. I would say agony. 25 Q. Was she conscious? 75 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Now, where was Jesus at the time this 3 happened? You said he was off-premises. 4 MR. ELLIS: At the time the alleged assault or 5 when she was in the basement? 6 BY MR. WEISS: 7 Q. Good point. At the time that the alleged 8 assault was reported to you by Jesus, you were 9 recounting that to me and you mentioned that he was off 10 premises at the time of the alleged assault. Where was 11 he, if you know, at the time of the alleged assault? 12 A. I believe he was at 850 Bryant pertaining to 13 his car. 14 Q. Did his car get towed or something? 15 A. I believe so. 16 Q. If a general manager -- strike that. The day 17 of the alleged assault, was Mr. Lopez on duty? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. And what I mean, to make it clearer still, 20 let's say the alleged assault happened around 11:30 a.m. 21 Was Mr. Lopez supposed to be on duty at the Hartland at 22 that time? 23 A. Well, he was working that day. 24 Q. And if he leaves the premises to go to 850 25 Bryant, for example, does he have to report that to 76 1 anyone? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Who does he have to report that to? 4 A. His supervisor. 5 Q. And that would be who? 6 A. Me. 7 Q. Did he report to you that he was going to 850 8 Bryant? 9 A. He did. 10 Q. How did you learn that? 11 A. I saw him earlier that morning and he reported 12 to me that he had to go take care of his car. 13 Q. At the time that you saw Mydra lying on the 14 floor, did you know how Ms. Samuel entered the basement? 15 A. No. 16 Q. At the time that you went to the Hartland 17 Hotel while Mydra was still there on the floor, did you 18 talk to Mr. Kang? 19 A. I believe so, when I entered the building. 20 Q. What was your discussion with Mr. Cane when 21 you entered the building? 22 A. I guess I recall, "What happened?" asking him 23 that. 24 Q. What did he say? 25 A. I think I recall him telling me that there was 77 1 a fight downstairs in the basement between Chanel and 2 Mydra 3 Q. Anything else? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Now, didn't you have a meeting planned with 6 Mydra and Chanel Samuel on May 30, 2008? 7 A. A meeting planned? 8 Q. Yes. 9 A. Not that I recall. 10 Q. Okay. Is there any sort of rule at the THC 11 that a general manager should be on-site at all times 12 during their shift? 13 A. No. The standard is they are at work, they 14 let their supervisor know if they have to go off-site. 15 Q. Otherwise they are supposed to be on-site? 16 A. Except for meetings and courthouse appearances 17 for evictions, yes. 18 Q. You mentioned evictions. What are the 19 reasons in 2008 that someone would be evicted from a THC 20 property like the Hartland Hotel? 21 A. The reasons for eviction? 22 Q. Correct. 23 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague and ambiguous. 24 Overbroad. Incomplete hypothetical. 25 78 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. You may answer. 3 A. Violations to a lease agreement, like other 4 tenants sign. It's a standard lease agreement. 5 Standard housing. Lease violations can lead to 6 eviction. 7 Q. Can you think of some lease violations that in 8 2008 would typically lead to an eviction of the tenant? 9 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 10 BY MR. WEISS: 11 Q. Go ahead. 12 A. Sometimes hording and cluttering cases can 13 lead to eviction. Fighting on the premises. Physical 14 violence. 15 Q. Anything else? Nonpayment of rent? 16 A. Yes, nonpayment of rent. 17 Q. Anything else? 18 A. I think those are the standard cases we see. 19 Q. How about violation of the house rules, would 20 that be a basis of eviction? 21 A. Would that be a basis of eviction? 22 Q. Yes. 23 A. Yes. The house rules are attached to the 24 lease. So anything that violates the house rules, also 25 violates the lease. 79 1 Q. So, for example, a tenant could hypothetically 2 be evicted from a THC property in 2008 for use or 3 possession of illegal drugs on the hotel or premises? 4 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 5 hypothetical. Asked and answered. Vague and ambiguous. 6 BY MR. WEISS: 7 Q. You can answer. 8 A. It depends. We have procedures to help people 9 maintain their housing. And when there is an incident 10 report, we investigate, we take the appropriate steps -- 11 that can be a written violation; that can sometimes be 12 an informal conference with tenants and management; that 13 can be a housing retention contract; and that can also 14 be eviction. 15 Q. Have you ever heard that Ms. Samuel walked off 16 the job while she was employed by the THC? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Have you ever learned personally that 19 Ms. Samuel used illicit drugs on the premises of a THC 20 property? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Prior to the alleged assault of May 30, were 23 you aware of Ms. Samuel ever being hostile to any other 24 tenants or employees of the THC? 25 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 80 1 hypothetical. Vague as to hostile. 2 THE WITNESS: No. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. Prior to the alleged assault of May 30, 2008, 5 were you ever aware of Ms. Samuel threatening violence 6 to a tenant or employee of the THC? 7 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 8 THE WITNESS: No. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. Were you ever aware prior to May 30, 11 2008 -- strike that. Do you know who -- is it Laura 12 McElroy, is that her name? 13 A. There is a Laure McElroy. 14 Q. Laure, I'm sorry. What is her position there? 15 A. She is a case manager. 16 Q. Do you know her? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Does she work at any particular hotel? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Which one? 21 A. The Hartland. 22 Q. Now, were you ever aware of -- prior to 23 May 30, 2008, whether Ms. McElroy had an informal 24 meeting with Mydra McGarr and Chanel Samuel over an 25 argument over a loan? 81 1 A. No. 2 MR. ELLIS: Objection -- strike the 3 objection. 4 BY MR. WEISS: 5 Q. Now, you mentioned that Ms. Samuel was a 6 probationary -- I'm sorry. You mentioned that you knew 7 that Ms. Samuel was a floating janitor at the THC. 8 Correct? 9 A. Correct. 10 Q. When did she become employed in that position, 11 if you know? 12 A. I believe it was in March of '08. 13 Q. Now, when you say she was employed there March 14 of '08, was she working in another position at the THC 15 prior to March of '08? 16 A. Previously I knew her in the capacity of a 17 desk clerk. 18 Q. When you knew her as a desk clerk -- I can't 19 remember. Did you mention the year that was? 20 A. You asked when I met her first. 21 Q. Right. 22 A. I recall when I was a supervisor, and that was 23 from May of '06 until I recall visiting a hotel where 24 she was a desk clerk to meet with my case manager. 25 Q. Now, from going from desk clerk to floating 82 1 janitor, does she have to be hired anew to go from one 2 position to another? 3 A. Correct. 4 Q. So if she was a desk clerk and then became a 5 floating janitor, would she have to terminate her 6 employment with THC and then get rehired? 7 A. To transfer job positions? 8 Q. Correct. 9 A. One would need to go through the interview 10 process and then if offered and accepts, she would leave 11 that previous position. 12 Q. Okay. Because I'm just curious why you would 13 call it being hired for the position of floating janitor 14 if it's just a transfer from one position to another. 15 A. I believe she was interviewed for the floating 16 janitor position and passed the interview process. 17 Q. And at the THC that's considered hiring? 18 A. When an applicant interviews and passes -- 19 Well, there is an interview panel. And I believe there 20 is a background check, and HR performs that paperwork 21 and HR performs the reference checks. And at that stage 22 if an applicant meets the criteria, passes those things, 23 then they could be offered a position and then they 24 would accept that position if they chose to. 25 Q. So I guess my question is, at the THC that's 83 1 considered being hired -- 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. -- anew? 4 A. Hired for a position, yes. 5 Q. Okay. I understand. So even though you're 6 employed by the THC, if you go from one position to a 7 new position and you go through the whole interview 8 process, that's considered being hired? 9 A. Sure. 10 Q. Okay. Now, when you get hired, when you 11 change positions and therefore are hired for the new 12 position, is there a new probationary period? 13 A. There is, correct. 14 Q. So Ms. Samuel would have necessarily had a 90 15 day probationary period for desk clerk. Correct? 16 A. When she was hired, before the floating 17 janitor position, I believe we had a probationary period 18 for the employees. 19 Q. And then when Ms. Samuel was hired for the 20 floating janitor job, she would have had another 90 days 21 probationary period? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Now, this probationary period, what occurs 24 during that period? 25 A. A 90 day probationary period means you are an 84 1 at-will employee. We have a union presently. So you 2 don't have union rights yet, so your status is at-will. 3 Q. I see. So once you pass that, then you are in 4 the union? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Okay. Now, in April of 2008, did you ever 7 receive any sort of communication from Mr. Lopez telling 8 you that Ms. McGarr was having some sort of conflict 9 with Ms. Samuel? 10 A. No. 11 Q. During the probationary period, do you know 12 how many hours per week Ms. Samuel worked? 13 A. Full time is 37.5 hours. 14 Q. Were her hours ever reduced during the 15 probationary period? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Well, maybe I should ask it this way. In 18 April of 2008, did you ever reduce the amount of hours 19 Ms. Samuel worked at the Hartland Hotel as a floating 20 janitor? 21 A. No. 22 Q. In April of 2008, did you ever reduce the 23 amount of hours Ms. Samuel worked at the THC? 24 A. No. 25 Q. During the probationary period that started 85 1 when Ms. Samuel became a floating janitor, did she have 2 any write-ups for job performance? 3 A. No. 4 Q. Did she have any verbal warnings during that 5 period? 6 A. No. 7 Q. During her probationary period as floating 8 janitor, was Ms. Samuel ever transferred to different 9 hotels to work? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Why was that? 12 A. She was a floating janitor. 13 Q. I see, wherever you needed her, that's where 14 she would fit in? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. And would she be typically be sent to one 17 property or another, for example, to cover vacation of 18 an employee -- 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. -- or absence for some other reason? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. And we talked a little earlier today about 23 incident reports. Let me ask it this way. 24 On May 29, 2008, were you aware that 25 Ms. Samuel had filed one or more incident reports 86 1 concerning -- did I say "Ms. Samuel". Let me start 2 over. 3 On May 29, 2008, were you aware that 4 Ms. McGarr had filed one or more incident reports 5 concerning Ms. Samuel? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. And that's because Mr. Lopez told you? 8 A. Mydra reported to me an incident that 9 occurred. Procedure is to fill out an incident report. 10 I recall hearing that there was a written incident 11 report. 12 Q. And you heard that from Mr. Lopez? 13 A. I don't recall if it was Mr. Lopez or Mydra 14 that told me about the written report. 15 Q. About the what? 16 A. About the written incident report. 17 Q. But did Mr. McGarr also call you on May 29 18 about an incident? 19 A. Ms. McGarr was in my office after a safety 20 meeting on that day and reported to me an incident that 21 happened earlier that day. 22 Q. And we are talking about May 29. Right? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And what did Ms. McGarr report to you? 25 A. She reported to me that she was at the front 87 1 desk, working at the front desk, and that Chanel came in 2 the front desk door, got some water and slammed the door 3 on the way out, and some tenants were in the area when 4 that happened. 5 Q. The fact that tenants were in the area, is 6 that of any significance to you? 7 A. The tenant at the front desk seemed to be, 8 according to Mydra, upset about the door slamming. 9 Q. And were there any other incidents on the 29th 10 reported to you in any way, shape, or form after the 11 door slamming incident? 12 A. I recall at about 4:55 that day, I was 13 off-site, I received a phone call from Jesus, the 14 general manager, that another verbal disagreement 15 happened between Chanel and Mydra. 16 Q. And what was the nature of the disagreement? 17 MR. ELLIS: I'm sorry. What did Jesus tell 18 her the nature of the disagreement was? 19 BY MR. WEISS: 20 Q. What did you learn was the nature of the 21 disagreement? 22 MR. ELLIS: At that time from Jesus or later? 23 MR. WEISS: From anyone. 24 MR. ELLIS: When? 25 88 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. We are talking about May 29. We have gone 3 over the first incident, which was verbally reported to 4 Ms. Carrigan by Ms. McGarr. Then Ms. Carrigan learned 5 of another incident at 4:55. And I am asking what she 6 learned about that incident? What was that all about, 7 the 4:55? 8 A. I was informed by Jesus that there had been 9 another verbal like disruption between Chanel and Mydra 10 at the front desk. I don't recall the content -- 11 Q. Okay. 12 A. -- of what their verbal communication was. 13 Q. Okay. Did you ever see any writings 14 concerning any of the incidents? 15 A. Yes. 16 MR. WEISS: Let's have this marked as 17 Plaintiff's next in order, Plaintiff's number 5. Please 18 hand that to the witness. 19 (Incident Report - Hartland Hotel dated 20 5/29/08 marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 5 for 21 identification.) 22 23 BY MR. WEISS: 24 Q. Exhibit 5, is that the incident Ms. McGarr 25 reported to you verbally? 89 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. And did you ever see the writing on May 29 as 3 well, the writing being Exhibit 5? 4 A. Not that I recall. 5 Q. When was it that you first saw Exhibit 5? 6 A. An estimate would be Friday the 30th in the 7 morning. 8 Q. How was it that it came to your attention 9 then? 10 A. I don't recall. 11 Q. Do you know what time it was that you saw it 12 on the 30th? 13 A. It would have been after 9:00 a.m. 14 Q. Is that when you start work? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Was it on your desk when you got to work? Do 17 you remember that? 18 A. I don't recall if it was faxed to me or not. 19 Q. So, in other words, someone might have faxed 20 it to you and came to your desk and said: We just got 21 this in or something like that? 22 A. Yes. It would have been a fax sheet in my 23 inbox and I retrieve items from my box. 24 Q. I just was looking at the bottom of this and 25 it's got e-mail and I wonder if it was e-mailed to you 90 1 somehow or notice that it was e-mailed to you? 2 A. The document was most likely not e-mailed to 3 me. 4 Q. Actually, on Exhibit 5 there is a section 5 called Managerial Action. Do you see that? 6 A. I do. 7 Q. First, there is an X in the box that says, 8 "Written Violation Notice: Action: Written violation 9 number one." Is that Mydra's handwriting, do you know, 10 or is that yours? 11 A. No. It's a managerial action so it is not 12 Mydra's or my handwriting. 13 Q. Do you know whose it is? 14 A. It appears to be Jesus Lopez. 15 Q. And then there is another box below that 16 check: "Other: E-mailed. P.S. Colleen Carrigan about 17 issue." Did you get an e-mail about this? 18 A. I recall receiving an e-mail from Jesus. 19 Q. There is a signature under Manager Signature. 20 Do you recognize that as Mr. Lopez's signature? 21 A. I do. 22 Q. And it's dated 5/30/08. Do you see that? 23 A. I do. 24 Q. Does that also show that you probably received 25 it on May 30, '08? 91 1 A. I believe so. 2 Q. Do you recall getting an e-mail about this 3 written violation number one on May 29? 4 A. I recall exchanging e-mails with Jesus. I 5 don't recall the exact time of that. 6 MR. WEISS: Let's have this marked as 7 Plaintiff's 6, and then please hand it to the witness. 8 (Incident Report - Hartland Hotel dated 9 5/29/08 marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 6 for 10 identification.) 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. Okay. You are a fast reader. So Plaintiff's 13 6, when was the first time you think you saw that? 14 A. On Friday morning, the 30th. 15 Q. And looking again under Managerial Action, 16 it's got, "Written Violation Notice. Action: Written 17 violation number one." Do you know what that refers to? 18 A. Well, I -- yes. 19 Q. Looking under Summary of Incident, it's a 20 sentence, the very last sentence under the handwriting, 21 which I see is Ms. McGarr's, "She then walked pass me on 22 her phone stating that I got her wrote up and was 23 calling me out of my name." 24 Do you know what that expression means 25 "Calling me out of my name"? 92 1 A. Not entirely, no. 2 Q. What understanding of that at all do you have? 3 I am not even saying there is one definition of it, but 4 what is your understanding of it if you have any? 5 A. I hear it used. I assume it means 6 disrespectful. 7 Q. Okay. I can go with that. Were you concerned 8 at all when you saw in the Summary of Incident that 9 there was yelling going on, "that Chanel came in and 10 started yelling that I'm the biggest hater and nobody 11 wants me working here and where is Jesus here so I can 12 tell him about when you slammed the door on me" -- I 13 can't read the note right now. But in any event, did 14 you read about the yelling part when you got this? 15 A. I read this when I received it. 16 Q. Any concern about the yelling at all on your 17 part? 18 MR. ELLIS: Vague as to concern. 19 BY MR. WEISS: 20 Q. I mean, when you got this second report, did 21 you have any plans in mind as to what you would do about 22 it? 23 A. As manager -- 24 Q. Whatever your position was at the time. 25 A. -- my role was to investigate, follow up on 93 1 incident reports pertaining to matters in our hotels. 2 Q. Okay. What did you plan to do when you 3 received the second report? 4 A. Follow up with the parties involved. 5 Q. In any particular manner? 6 A. Speak with them individually, speak with my 7 general manager, Jesus, follow up with my supervisor, 8 James Holland. 9 Q. Okay. Looking again at Plaintiff's 6, there 10 is another box checked that says "Repeat Violation" and 11 then it's got "Will schedule a tenant conference." What 12 is a tenant conference? 13 A. A tenant conference is for tenants in our 14 hotels that we issue documentation in terms of lease 15 violations, we sometimes meet with tenants individually, 16 the general manager, the tenant -- sometimes the general 17 manager and the tenant and that person's case manager, 18 in what we call a tenant conference. 19 Q. Do you recognize Exhibit 6 as being signed by 20 Mr. Lopez? 21 A. I do. 22 MR. WEISS: Okay. I am going to have this 23 marked as Plaintiff's 7, and after would you please pass 24 this on to the witness. 25 /// 94 1 (E-mail string with the top one dated 5/29/08 2 marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 7 for identification.) 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. Have you had a chance to review that? 5 A. I did. 6 Q. All right. So this is an e-mail and it's from 7 you to Hartland Hotel manager. Would that be Mr. Lopez? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. And then you have, "Hi Jesus, I followed up 10 with Chanel about this in light of something else." 11 What are you talking about there something else? 12 A. She came down to my office on Thursday 13 reported to me the day before she was at the All Star 14 Hotel and a tenant had made a comment that she thought 15 was inappropriate and so I was talking to her about 16 that. 17 Q. Do you remember what the comment was? 18 A. She said she was at the front desk tying her 19 shoe and it was a male tenant that made a comment about 20 her in the position of leaning over and tying her shoe. 21 Q. Kind of like a sexual harassment like comment? 22 A. It sounded that she was offended by what he 23 said and it could have been sexual in nature. 24 Q. Do you recall at this time what the exact 25 comment was? 95 1 A. I don't. 2 Q. You said, "I followed up with Chanel about 3 this in light of something else." What do you mean you 4 followed up with Chanel about this? Are you referring 5 to the two incident reports that we just looked at? 6 A. Well, there was only one report that I 7 received at 4:12 p.m. when I replied back to Jesus, that 8 was that Mydra had reported to me one incident had 9 occurred with them at the front desk. I spoke with 10 Chanel about that incident. 11 Q. So when Ms. McGarr reported the incident to 12 you, which was the incident report, the first one, you 13 actually talked to Ms. Samuel about that report? 14 A. I spoke with Chanel that I received a report 15 at the hotel that in the front desk area there was a 16 disagreement between she and Mydra. 17 Q. When did you talk to Ms. Samuel about that? 18 A. I'm estimating, it would have been somewhere 19 between 3:00 o'clock and 4:00 o'clock. 20 Q. And was this in person or over the phone? 21 A. It was in person. She stopped by. 22 Q. She came by your office? 23 A. She did. 24 Q. What was your discussion with her? 25 A. As part of my role as a manager is to -- I 96 1 received knowledge of a report at the hotel and my role 2 is to follow up with her directly about her involvement 3 and get her side of the story and hear from her what 4 happened. 5 Q. What was your discussion with Ms. Samuel when 6 she came to you at the time you just mentioned between 7 3:00 and 4:00 on the 29th? What was your discussion? 8 What did you say? What did she say to you? 9 A. What I recall is discussing from what I 10 learned of, I wanted to hear from her what happened 11 according to her, that I was concerned about behavior 12 that was disruptive in the front desk, that it's not 13 okay for tenants to go behind the front desk -- even if 14 she was getting water, it's a work place area, she 15 wasn't working that day, she shouldn't be back there. 16 It's confusing to staff and tenants if tenants are back 17 there. And when I heard that tenants were upset about 18 the slamming of the door, that was also a concern to me 19 so I spoke to her about the behavior, it sounded 20 inappropriate. And that I will follow up with Jesus in 21 terms of it occurring at the hotel and that she being a 22 tenant she might receive a written violation for her 23 inappropriate behavior. 24 Q. What did Ms. Samuel say to you? 25 A. She said to me, "Okay, I get it." And she 97 1 suggested that Mydra, Jesus, myself and her meet next 2 week. 3 Q. Was she angry at all? 4 A. She did not appear angry to me. 5 Q. At the time that you're talking about her 6 being a tenant behind the desk, but she was also an 7 employee at the THC, wasn't she? 8 A. Not in the capacity that she works out of the 9 Hartland or that she was working at that moment. She 10 was not on her schedule. She wasn't currently working 11 during that time. 12 Q. But at that time, she was an employee of the 13 THC, right? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Let me ask that again so it's not confusing. 16 At the time you had this -- at the time Ms. Samuel went 17 behind the desk to get water, she may not have been on 18 the clock but she was employed at the THC, wasn't she? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Did she think that she was allowed to go 21 behind the desk because she was an employee of the THC? 22 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 23 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 24 BY MR. WEISS: 25 Q. Did she tell you that: "I can go back there 98 1 because I am an employee"? 2 A. I don't recall. 3 Q. Was anyone else present when you had this 4 conversation with Ms. Samuel between 3:00 and 5 4:00 o'clock on the 29th? 6 A. No. 7 Q. So "I followed up with Chanel about this in 8 light of something else." And the something else, you 9 said, was the alleged improper comment by some tenant at 10 a different hotel? 11 A. That she had reported to me, correct. 12 Q. Why would you connect the two incidents? Why 13 would you follow up with Chanel about this incident with 14 Ms. McGarr and connect it to this other improper 15 comment? 16 A. I don't understand that. 17 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Misstates testimony. 18 BY MR. WEISS: 19 Q. Let me just make it clear. Your statement in 20 the e-mail says "I followed up with Chanel about this in 21 light of something else." And you mentioned the 22 something else was this comment by a tenant. Right? 23 A. When I met with Chanel, the content of my 24 conversation -- what I was discussing with her, again as 25 a supervisor, I was checking in with her about something 99 1 else, not this incident. When I had her with me in my 2 office, I felt it necessary to speak with her about this 3 incident that I heard of earlier in the day. 4 Q. So when you say you talked with her about the 5 incident with Ms. McGarr and then in light of a 6 completely different incident not involving Ms. McGarr, 7 I don't understand why you are connecting the two. 8 That's what I'm asking. 9 A. I didn't intend to connect the two. 10 Q. Are you sure that this something else didn't 11 refer to some other dispute that Ms. McGarr had with 12 someone else aside from a tenant? 13 A. Aside from a tenant? 14 Q. Right. 15 A. Can you repeat that? 16 Q. This something else that you refer to in this 17 first sentence, are you sure that this something else 18 was about Ms. Chanel getting involved in another 19 altercation with someone other than the tenant? 20 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Asked and answered. 21 THE WITNESS: I didn't see the two combined. 22 I only mentioned it as part of my conversation with her 23 as her manager. Jesus didn't need to know details about 24 that, it didn't relate. 25 100 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Okay. The second paragraph in this e-mail 3 Exhibit 7, you say, "Go ahead and put together the 4 write-up for slamming the door and Chanel may check in 5 with you about the incident." Did Ms. Samuel say she 6 was going to talk to Jesus about this incident, the door 7 slamming incident? 8 A. When she suggested that we meet as a group, I 9 said to her, "Well, you can check in with Jesus about 10 it." That's always available for tenants. It's 11 important that they and the property manager speak about 12 incidents at the hotel. 13 Q. Okay. And your response we just went over at 14 4:12 p.m., that was in response to the e-mail, which is 15 on the same page for some reason, by Mr. Lopez to you at 16 2:20 p.m.? 17 A. Yes. It's a direct reply. 18 Q. Do you know why these two e-mails would be 19 combined on one page? 20 A. I think that's systematic. I think that's 21 part of the e-mail program. 22 Q. Were there any e-mails between 2:20 p.m. and 23 4:12 p.m. between you and Mr. Lopez about this regard, 24 about this issue? 25 A. Not that I recall. 101 1 Q. Do you know -- may be this is a good time to 2 break. We will come back and have some more questions. 3 (Noon Recess Taken.) 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 102 1 AFTERNOON SESSION 2 BY MR. WEISS: 3 Q. Yes. When I was looking at Plaintiff 6, that 4 was that second report that you got? 5 A. Can I look at it? 6 Q. Looking at the bottom, it's got, "Will 7 schedule a tenant conference," do you see that? 8 A. I do. 9 Q. Wasn't there a tenant conference scheduled for 10 the 30th at 2:00 or 2:30 in the afternoon involving the 11 two incident reports Ms. McGarr wrote? 12 A. Not that I recall. 13 Q. Have you ever talked to Mr. Lopez about having 14 a conference the next day at 2:00 or 2:30? 15 A. I don't recall. 16 Q. Was there a conference scheduled at all? 17 A. Not that I'm aware of. 18 Q. Given the two incident reports and your 19 discussion with Ms. Samuel that you mentioned on the 20 afternoon of the 29th, when would have been a likely 21 time to schedule a conference? 22 A. A tenant conference? 23 Q. Right. 24 A. For a tenant conference, again, it's a general 25 manager and a tenant, and a likely time would have been 103 1 72 hours within an incident happening. 2 Q. And I didn't want to confuse you, so that's a 3 tenant conference. But wasn't there a conference set 4 involving Ms. McGarr and Ms. Samuel and you and 5 Mr. Lopez set for the 30th in the afternoon? 6 A. Not that I am aware of. Chanel suggested us 7 meeting on the 29th. She suggested that to me. I am 8 not inclined to bring all parties into a room together 9 as part of an investigation. An investigation, as we 10 approach them, are individual and confidential. 11 MR. WEISS: Okay. Let's mark this as next in 12 order. Is this 7 or 8, I can't remember. 13 (Incident Report - Hartland Hotel dated 14 5/30/08 marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 8 for 15 identification.) 16 BY MR. WEISS: 17 Q. Take a look at that. Have you had a chance to 18 look at that? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. When was the first time you saw this document 21 number 8? 22 A. After the incident. I don't remember exactly 23 when I first saw this. 24 Q. And on the top on the right side it's got RM 25 Number or Title. Does that refer to Ms. McGarr's 104 1 employment classification? 2 A. "RM", what that stands for? 3 Q. Yes. 4 A. Room number or title. 5 Q. So that's Chanel Samuel and for Mydra McGarr 6 it's got janitor. And underneath that it's got "CAD 7 number." What's that? 8 A. I believe that's a police number. A CAD 9 number, I think that's when the police come and they 10 fill out a report, I think that's the number of the 11 report. 12 Q. When who fills out a report? 13 A. I think when the police arrive at a site, they 14 leave a CAD number. I don't know what CAD stands for. 15 I think that's their record. 16 Q. Oh, like a police report number? 17 A. I think so. 18 Q. Now, on the second page of this, there is 19 handwriting, further handwriting. Whose handwriting is 20 that, if you know? 21 A. I believe that's James Kang the desk clerk. 22 Q. He has the person that actually witnessed the 23 alleged assault? 24 A. According to his report. He says he went 25 downstairs to see what was going on. "Upon my arrival, 105 1 I witnessed Chanel strike Mydra across the face with a 2 pipe." 3 Q. Now, did you take any pictures of the incident 4 scene? 5 A. No. 6 Q. Did anyone at THC take pictures of the 7 incident scene? 8 A. Not that I am aware of. 9 Q. Have you ever seen any pictures of the 10 incident scene? 11 A. No. 12 Q. Did you ever visit Mydra in the hospital? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Did you ever send her flowers? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Did you ever send her a card? 17 A. We arranged to send her flowers and 18 strawberries. I don't know if there was a separate 19 card. 20 Q. Let me ask you this. If Ms. McGarr was able 21 to return to work, would she be able to come back to the 22 Hartland Hotel or some other THC property and work? 23 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 24 hypothetical. Calls for speculation. 25 THE WITNESS: She is an employee still with 106 1 the agency I believe she is out on workers' comp. 2 BY MR. WEISS: 3 Q. But if she is released by the doctor, she is 4 eligible to work there still. Right? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. And if she couldn't do her job as a janitor 7 but could do another job, would she be accommodated in a 8 different job? 9 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 10 THE WITNESS: Yes. 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. Okay. Were you the one that distributed 13 paychecks for the Hartland Hotel? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Who distributes paychecks? 16 A. HR delivers them to 449 and general managers 17 come to pick them up. 18 Q. The morning of the 30th, did Ms. Samuel come 19 to you to get her paycheck? 20 A. She did. 21 Q. And if the managers distribute paychecks, do 22 you know why she came to you? 23 A. She is a floating janitor so I am her 24 supervisor. 25 Q. Oh, I see. And what time did she come in to 107 1 get the check? 2 A. Probably after 10:00 o'clock. That's usually 3 when they get to 449. 4 Q. And when she came to get her check, did you 5 have any conversation with her at all? 6 A. Briefly. I walked her back out to the front 7 desk where her check was. Her check wasn't with me. It 8 was with the admin assistant. 9 Q. Did you have any conversation with her, was my 10 question? 11 A. Yes. I said, "Your check is not with me. 12 It's out front. Let's go grab it." I asked her how she 13 was doing. She said she was doing all right. She 14 talked about her interest in being an assistant manager. 15 She had been to HR kind of inquiring about that. 16 Q. Okay. Did she talk about the two incident 17 reports on the 29th? 18 A. No. 19 Q. So when she came to pick her paycheck up, you 20 two never discussed at all the incidents on the 29th? 21 A. No. I asked her how she was doing. And I 22 also said, "You know, on Monday morning check in with me 23 once you are back at work." 24 Q. Now, was there anything about her demeanor the 25 morning of the 30th that indicated something erratical 108 1 or abnormal? 2 A. No. 3 Q. After the two incident reports, did you think 4 it was safe for Ms. McGarr to go to work on the 30th 5 knowing that Ms. Samuel was at the hotel? 6 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 7 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. 8 THE WITNESS: It didn't occur to me. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. Right. 11 MR. ELLIS: I'm sorry? Did you say "Why"? 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. No. I didn't even hear her. I thought she 14 said: If it occurred to me? 15 A. No. I said, "It did not occur to me." 16 Q. Oh, I didn't hear to you. You might want to 17 keep your voice up a little bit. So you weren't worried 18 on the morning of the 30th that there could be any 19 further conflict between Ms. McGarr and Ms. Samuel? 20 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 21 THE WITNESS: What I was doing at the time was 22 giving her her check. 23 BY MR. WEISS: 24 Q. That's not my question. You have to stick to 25 the question. 109 1 A. Okay. 2 Q. The question is: Were you worried at all that 3 there could be further incidents between Ms. McGarr and 4 Ms. Samuel given the incidents on the 29th? 5 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 6 THE WITNESS: No. 7 BY MR. WEISS: 8 Q. Okay. I had a question on this floating 9 situation. Who scheduled where Ms. Samuel would work on 10 any given day? 11 A. I did. 12 Q. And do you know, well, from the time 13 Ms. Samuel started working as a floating janitor, how 14 often she worked at the Hartland Hotel? 15 A. I believe she worked at the Hartland Hotel a 16 couple of times. 17 Q. Did you ever change anything to do with 18 Ms. Samuel's schedule as a floating janitor due to any 19 reported incidents between her and Ms. McGarr in April 20 of 2008? 21 A. No. 22 Q. When you saw Ms. Samuel on the morning of the 23 30th, did you speak about the second incident report? 24 A. I did not. 25 Q. Any particular reason? 110 1 A. It did not occur to me to be important to 2 discuss that with her right then. 3 Q. Did you talk about setting up a meeting to 4 talk to her and Mr. Lopez? 5 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Asked and answered. 6 THE WITNESS: On the morning of the 30th? 7 BY MR. WEISS: 8 Q. Correct. 9 A. No. 10 Q. Did you ever -- Well, Ms. Samuel was arrested 11 as a result of this alleged assault. Right? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Taken to jail? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. You knew that. Right? 16 A. I've read it on the report. 17 Q. Did you ever visit Ms. Samuel in jail? 18 A. No. 19 Q. To your knowledge, did any other THC employees 20 visit Ms. Samuel in jail? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Was Ms. Samuel terminated from her job as a 23 result of the alleged incident? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. And why was that? 111 1 A. It was an egregious violation. 2 Q. We are talking about an alleged incident. Did 3 you determine at the time that she was somehow at fault 4 for this incident? 5 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague as to fault. 6 Incomplete hypothetical. 7 THE WITNESS: I didn't make that decision. I 8 was informed of it. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. I see. Who actually terminated Ms. Samuel? 11 A. I don't know. 12 Q. How did you learn she was terminated? 13 A. I was given that information by my supervisor. 14 Q. Mr. Holland? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Did he tell you in person or by writing? 17 A. It was in person. 18 Q. Do you know when that was? 19 A. I believe it was later during the 30th, later 20 in the day. 21 Q. Have you ever talked to Ms. Samuel since the 22 date of the incident? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Have you ever seen her since the date of the 25 incident? 112 1 A. In the courthouse for the criminal proceeding. 2 Q. Okay. Have you ever talked to Ms. Samuel's 3 lawyer? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Do you know what his name is? 6 A. The you public defender? 7 Q. Right. 8 A. Chris. I don't know his last name. 9 Q. Is it Hite, H-I-T-E? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. When did you first talk to him? 12 A. I believe he called me regarding the case, the 13 criminal proceeding. I don't remember when it was. 14 Q. What was your conversation with him on that 15 first phone call? 16 A. It was either with him or his clerk. I don't 17 know what her name is or what her title is. Someone 18 from the public defender's office contacted me. It was 19 either he or this woman. And they informed me they were 20 calling about the incident, the case regarding that 21 incident. And they asked if I was Chanel's supervisor, 22 and I said that I was. They may have asked how long I 23 was her supervisor, what work she did, and if I had 24 received any complaints about her. And at one point, I 25 was unfamiliar with the process and I said, "You know, I 113 1 think I need to talk to someone in my agency before I 2 speak more with you." So at that point they decided to 3 subpoena us. 4 Q. Who is "they"? 5 A. I guess Chanel's attorneys. 6 Q. What was your first conversation with her 7 attorney? 8 A. I think that example that I just gave you. 9 Q. You said you weren't certain. I thought you 10 said it was her assistant. 11 A. I don't remember if it was Chris who called me 12 first or if he had the woman call me first. 13 Q. Well, I want to talk about your first 14 conversation with Mr. Hite. Forget the assistant. What 15 was your first conversation with him? 16 A. I think in person I remember speaking with him 17 in the hallway of the courthouse. We were gathered 18 because they had subpoenaed us. They didn't need us one 19 day so they told us we could leave, and that was kind of 20 the content of the conversation. 21 Q. So the very first time you ever talked to 22 Mr. Hite was at the courthouse itself? 23 A. I believe so. 24 Q. Isn't it true that you had telephone 25 conversation with him about this case? 114 1 A. Again, I don't recall who those conversations 2 were with, if it was him directly or if he funneled out 3 his work to ask questions. 4 Q. So let me ask you this: From the public 5 defender's office, you received more than one contact? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. And you mentioned the first one, maybe it was 8 him, maybe it was an assistant, about your role as a 9 supervisor. What was the next conversation about? 10 A. The next conversation was that they would need 11 to subpoena us, that I am not going to speak with them 12 about the case without them going through the process of 13 subpoenaing me or any other employee they needed to talk 14 with. 15 Q. Did they ask you names of other employees to 16 subpoena? 17 A. I don't recall if they asked names or not. 18 Q. Did they help you -- Let me ask you this: How 19 did you receive your subpoena? 20 A. From 126 Hyde is like the main office. I 21 believe somebody either brought it to me or I went and 22 picked them up. 23 Q. You weren't personally served with that 24 subpoena, were you? 25 A. No. 115 1 Q. And, in fact, any of the employees of the THC 2 that appeared in court, whether they testified or not, 3 they weren't personally given the subpoenas, were they? 4 A. By a process server? 5 Q. Right. 6 A. No, not that I am aware of. 7 Q. And who at the THC arranged to have these 8 people receive their subpoena? 9 A. Arranged to have them? 10 Q. Right. They didn't serve people personally. 11 A. Right. 12 Q. They were brought to the office. Who arranged 13 for the people to come in and get their subpoena? 14 A. I don't know. 15 Q. Who gave you the one that you got? 16 A. Again, I believe someone either brought it to 17 me, like in interoffice mail, or when I was at 126, the 18 main office, an employee would have handed me the 19 paperwork. 20 Q. And at the time you got the subpoena, did you 21 have any idea what you were going to be asked? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Do you remember any conversations with 24 Chanel's lawyer about the case, criminal prosecution? 25 A. I remember speaking to him in the courthouse 116 1 that day when they didn't need us. And then when we got 2 called again and subpoenaed again, there was a group of 3 us waiting. And his -- I don't know who she was. She 4 sat with us in the hallway while, I guess, the attorneys 5 were in the courthouse or in the courtroom and we 6 waited. I remember the woman saying: "These things 7 take a long time." And then they broke for lunch, told 8 us to come back. So I don't recall, in terms of Chris 9 speaking with me that day directly, except when I asked 10 him if I could go because I hadn't been called yet. 11 Q. Did you have any conversations with Chris or 12 Mr. Hite, about what your testimony would be? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Did you have any conversation with any member 15 of the public defender's office about what your 16 testimony would be? 17 A. Not that I remember. 18 Q. So you had no idea why you were being called 19 as a witness? 20 A. Yes. I was really unsure why they called me 21 of everyone else. 22 Q. I was actually down there for that hearing. 23 Let me ask you this: How many people from the THC were 24 down there for that preliminary hearing aside from you? 25 A. Okay. I'm confused in terms of preliminary 117 1 hearing. We were called once and we just left, 2 something happened that day, and we were called again 3 where people did end up being called in. 4 Q. Let's say on the day that people were called 5 in. How many people were down there from the THC? 6 A. Myself, Jesus, the assistant, Emmanuel, James. 7 So I think six people. 8 Q. Wasn't there also a tenant there from the THC? 9 A. I don't remember. 10 Q. Isn't it true that while you waited outside 11 during testimony, a tenant of the THC was in there 12 listening and going back out to tell people what was 13 going on? 14 A. I don't know who that would have been. I 15 don't remember. 16 Q. You are under oath. You understand that. 17 Right? 18 A. I do. We have a lot of tenants. 19 Q. Okay. You didn't know that there was a tenant 20 from the THC there sitting inside the courtroom and he 21 came outside and told you and others what was going on 22 inside the courtroom? 23 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Asked and answered. 24 THE WITNESS: No, I don't recall that. 25 118 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Did you tell anyone at the public defender's 3 office who should be subpoenaed to testify? 4 A. I don't remember telling them that 5 information. 6 Q. Were you asked by anyone at the public 7 defender's office who should testify at the preliminary 8 hearing? 9 A. I don't recall them asking me that. 10 Q. When you were there at the courthouse with 11 Jesus and these other employees that you mentioned, at 12 that time did you know what you were going to be asked? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Didn't Mr. Lopez testify at the hearing? 15 A. I was not there when people actually got 16 called in to testify. I left, I think, right after 17 lunch. Prior to lunch, no one had been called in to 18 testify. 19 Q. Did Mr. Lopez ever tell you what he testified 20 to? 21 A. I don't recall. 22 Q. Did any employee of the THC that testified 23 tell you what the subject of their testimony was? 24 A. Not that I remember. 25 Q. Was anyone who was employed by the THC 119 1 threatened that if they didn't go testify against 2 Ms. McGarr, that they would be terminated or 3 disciplined? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Did you ever learn what the testimony of 6 anyone was at the preliminary hearing? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Did you know that Ms. Samuel claims 9 self-defense as a defense to the charges against her? 10 A. Did I know that? 11 Q. Yes. 12 A. No. 13 Q. Did you know that Mr. Lopez was asked many 14 questions about whether Ms. McGarr was defensive and 15 hard to get along with? 16 A. No, not that I recall. 17 Q. So, just to make things go quicker, do you 18 have any idea what Mr. Lopez testified to at all? 19 A. At the preliminary hearing? 20 Q. Correct. 21 A. No. 22 Q. Did you ever see a transcript of the 23 preliminary hearing? 24 A. No. 25 Q. Did any other employees of the THC see a 120 1 transcript of the preliminary hearing? 2 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 3 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 4 BY MR. WEISS: 5 Q. Did you know that people, employees of THC, 6 were asking Ms. McGarr at the preliminary hearing if she 7 was going to file suit? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Just to clean this up. Did anyone ever report 10 to you what the subject of any THC employee was at the 11 preliminary hearing? 12 A. What the subject of any THC employee was? 13 Q. Testimony. 14 A. No, not that I am aware of. 15 Q. At the end of the day, do you know who 16 actually testified from the THC at the preliminary 17 hearing? 18 A. I believe James, the desk clerk did, and I 19 believe that Anh or Anh, another desk clerk, did. 20 Q. Who? 21 A. I think her name is Anh, A-N-H. 22 Q. Do you know her last name? 23 A. I don't. 24 Q. And who was the other person you said? 25 A. I believe James. 121 1 Q. James Kang? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. How about Mr. Lopez, did he testify? 4 A. I don't remember. 5 Q. Did anyone from THC produce any documents 6 concerning Ms. McGarr's employment to the defense lawyer 7 of Ms. Samuel? 8 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Speculation. 9 THE WITNESS: If we were subpoenaed for 10 documents, we would have provided them. 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. I am just asking if that was actually 13 accomplished. Were documents concerning Ms. McGarr 14 actually given to the lawyer of Ms. Samuel? 15 MR. ELLIS: Same objection. 16 THE WITNESS: I don't remember. 17 BY MR. WEISS: 18 Q. Do you know when the trial is scheduled for 19 the criminal case? 20 A. I have no idea. 21 Q. Have you ever been asked to testify in that 22 case? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Do you know if any other THC employees have 25 been asked to testify in that case? 122 1 A. I don't know. 2 Q. I forgot to ask. Did you have any 3 conversations with Ms. McGarr at all after the incident 4 occurred? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. And when was that? 7 A. I spoke to her in the hospital I believe after 8 she got the flowers. I asked her how she was doing. 9 Q. Okay. And anything else? 10 A. She stopped by the office once. I'm guessing 11 it was a month after the 30th of May. 12 Q. And what was your conversation then? 13 A. She brought by some family and introduced me 14 to them. I asked her how she was doing and if she was 15 getting like the medical care that she needed for the 16 injury she sustained. And she kind of gave me an update 17 of where she was staying. And I gave her a number for 18 the employee assistance program. 19 Q. Okay. Did you tell Ms. McGarr that Ms. Samuel 20 could come back and live at the Hartland Hotel? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Did you ever tell Ms. McGarr that Ms. Samuel 23 could come back to live at the Hartland if she got out 24 of jail? 25 A. No. 123 1 Q. Now, Ms. McGarr wasn't a tenant at the THC, at 2 the time this happened, was she, the alleged assault? 3 A. No. 4 Q. Do you know of any other complaints Ms. McGarr 5 ever filed at the THC regarding anyone else bothering 6 her, threatening her? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. What do you remember about that? 9 A. She was working as a janitor at the Pierre. 10 She reported that a tenant had been harassing her and 11 she said directly she felt unsafe with this tenant. She 12 proceeded to get a temporary restraining order against 13 this tenant, it was granted, and we transferred her to 14 the Hartland Hotel. 15 Q. Did Mr. Lopez ever tell you that he had a 16 verbal altercation with Ms. Samuel but never wrote her 17 up? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Did you ever hear from Mr. Lopez or any other 20 THC employees that Ms. Samuel refused to do the work 21 that she was supposed to do as a floating janitor? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Did Mr. Lopez ever talk to you about problems 24 he had had with Ms. Samuel? 25 A. No. 124 1 Q. If Ms. Samuel had keys to the elevator, would 2 that have been improper? 3 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague and ambiguous. 4 Calls for speculation. Incomplete hypothetical. 5 THE WITNESS: Yes. 6 BY MR. WEISS: 7 Q. Why would that be? 8 A. She did not work out of the Hartland. 9 Q. And do you know how she would get keys to the 10 elevator, if she had them? 11 A. No. 12 MR. WEISS: Let's mark this as Plaintiff's 9. 13 (Lease Addendum for Drug Free Housing marked 14 Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 9 for identification.) 15 16 BY MR. WEISS: 17 Q. Have you ever seen that document before, 18 number 9? 19 A. I recognize it as part of a lease agreement. 20 Q. And in that very first paragraph, number one, 21 about drug related criminal activity, did you know that 22 that was in Ms. Chanel's Lease Addendum for Drug Free 23 Housing? 24 A. It's part of the lease packet that we give to 25 all tenants. 125 1 Q. Does this refresh your recollection at all 2 whether THC had a drug free housing policy for it's 3 tenants? 4 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 5 hypothetical. Asked and answered. Vague and ambiguous. 6 THE WITNESS: It's part of our lease paperwork 7 and all tenants sign this paperwork, it goes into their 8 file. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. Prior to today's date, have you ever seen this 11 Lease Addendum for Drug Free Housing before? Just the 12 form itself, not the one that's signed here. 13 A. Sure. I've looked at the lease packet before 14 and I recognize this as being part of the packet. 15 Q. Okay. And paragraph six states that, "You or 16 a guest under your control shall not engage in acts of 17 violence or threats of violence, including but not 18 limited to the unlawful discharge of firearms." You 19 knew that was part of the lease package, didn't you, 20 that provision? 21 A. I recognize the terminology and what it's 22 stating as part of the lease packet, yes. 23 Q. Okay. And you knew that violation of 24 paragraph one or paragraph six of this document, Exhibit 25 number 9, could be considered good cause to terminate 126 1 the tenants rights? 2 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 3 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. Calls for 4 speculation. 5 BY MR. WEISS: 6 Q. You knew that. Right? 7 A. That it could be cause for eviction? 8 Q. Right. 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Now, let's see. Okay. Let's have this marked 11 as number 10. It's a document entitled Hartland Hotel 12 Final Written Violation Notice. 13 (Hartland Hotel Final Written Violation Notice 14 marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 10 for 15 identification.) 16 BY MR. WEISS: 17 Q. When was the first time you saw this document, 18 Exhibit 10? 19 A. I don't recall the date. I would -- I would 20 expect it was after it was put together. 21 Q. I know. I'm just asking you when was the 22 first time you saw it. It's dated June 2, '08. 23 A. Sure. Sometime on or after June 2nd. 24 Q. How did you receive this document? That's not 25 good question. How is it that you became aware of this 127 1 document? 2 A. It was with the eviction request packet. 3 Q. When did you see that? 4 A. On or after June 2, which I am guessing is a 5 Monday or a Tuesday. 6 Q. Why are you guessing that? 7 A. Because I don't remember what day of the week 8 that would have been. 9 Q. Okay. So in looking at the underlined 10 material, it says, "In summation, on 5/29/08 and 5/30/08 11 at approximately 11:30 a.m. you were reported to have 12 been involved in numerous incidents between a 24 hour 13 period that involved the hotel janitor being 14 hospitalized." 15 What are the numerous incidents it refers to? 16 A. I would look at the document to see what it 17 lists out. 18 Q. What document? 19 A. It goes on to say what happened. 20 Q. Okay. I'm just asking what were the numerous 21 incidents? You can tell me whatever you think they are. 22 MR. ELLIS: Objection. It calls for 23 speculation. 24 BY MR. WEISS: 25 Q. Just to save you your breath on speculation 128 1 objections, I am only asking for her knowledge, not to 2 guess. I only want to know your knowledge. You don't 3 have to guess. 4 MR. ELLIS: Well, her knowledge of what Jesus 5 was referring to when he wrote those incidents? 6 MR. WEISS: Right. 7 MR. ELLIS: Do you know what incidents Jesus 8 was referring to? 9 THE WITNESS: On this document, by reading 10 this document, I'm reading the incidents that are 11 listed. 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. Okay. Do you know why Mr. Lopez calls them 14 numerous? 15 A. I do not. 16 Q. Then it says, "On 5/29/08 at 12:30 p.m. you 17 entered the hotel front desk area unauthorized to grab 18 some water, you proceeded to exit the building and then 19 returned to the front desk and stated 'this is for 20 slamming the door on me two months ago' and slammed the 21 door as you left. Later that day at around 4:19 p.m. 22 you returned to the hotel and engaged in a verbal 23 argument with the hotel janitor." 24 Now, would you consider those two things 25 mentioned there to be erratic behavior? 129 1 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 2 Incomplete hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous as to 3 erratic behavior. 4 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 5 BY MR. WEISS: 6 Q. What do you mean you don't know? Didn't you 7 define erratic behavior earlier today? 8 MR. ELLIS: That's the question: Did you 9 define erratic behavior? So should we have read it 10 back? 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. No. You defined erratic behavior earlier 13 today, didn't you? 14 A. Yes, according to me. 15 Q. Well, according to your definition of erratic 16 behavior, would these two incidents mentioned by 17 Mr. Lopez on the 29th constitute erratic behavior? 18 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 19 THE WITNESS: It's inappropriate behavior. I 20 think it's inappropriate behavior. 21 BY MR. WEISS: 22 Q. Is it abnormal behavior? 23 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 24 hypothetical. Calls for speculation. Vague and 25 ambiguous. 130 1 THE WITNESS: I think it's inappropriate 2 behavior. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. But not abnormal? 5 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 6 THE WITNESS: Abnormal doesn't come to mind 7 regarding that behavior. To me that's inappropriate. 8 BY MR. WEISS: 9 Q. Erratic behavior either? 10 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. You consider that to be erratic behavior. 13 Right? 14 A. It's inappropriate. And erratic, sure, it's 15 not -- it's not, I guess, standard behavior where one 16 slams the door and -- 17 Q. Coming back, starting a verbal argument, is 18 that normal behavior? 19 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Misstates the 20 document. Incomplete hypothetical. Vague and 21 ambiguous. Calls for speculation. 22 BY MR. WEISS: 23 Q. You may answer. 24 MR. ELLIS: You are no longer going off this? 25 Starting an argument isn't included on this document. I 131 1 don't know that Ms. Samuel started any argument, and it 2 certainly doesn't say that in this document. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. The two incidents together on the 29th 5 involving Ms. Samuel, in your definition of abnormal, 6 would you consider them abnormal behavior? 7 MR. ELLIS: Incomplete hypothetical. Vague 8 and ambiguous. 9 THE WITNESS: I would consider them 10 inappropriate behavior at our hotels and in the work 11 place and that's why I wanted to follow up on them. 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. How do you distinguish between inappropriate 14 as opposed to erratic? 15 MR. ELLIS: Incomplete hypothetical. 16 THE WITNESS: Inappropriate is, to me, 17 unprofessional. It's inappropriate -- erratic, I 18 guess -- I've never thought of them being the same or 19 being different so. 20 BY MR. WEISS: 21 Q. So they are not different or they are? 22 A. I guess they are the same: Erratic, 23 inappropriate. Something that's outside of the norm I 24 guess would be erratic. Inappropriate to me just 25 sounds -- Well, to me what I think of when I think of 132 1 work and professional behavior, there is inappropriate 2 behavior, and that's what I think of. Erratic seems to 3 be outside of one's normalcy, and I don't know that I 4 can define that. 5 Q. Outside of one's normalcy, doesn't that mean 6 abnormal? Isn't abnormal the opposite of normal? 7 A. The opposite of normal. Yes. 8 Q. So the two incident on the 29th would be 9 abnormal, wouldn't they? 10 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 11 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. 12 THE WITNESS: I don't know what one's normal 13 is, but I recognize behavior that I deem inappropriate 14 for the workplace. 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. I see. So if it was normal for Ms. Samuel to 17 like slam doors, yell at people, and start arguments, 18 then you would just consider that normal for her? 19 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 20 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. 21 THE WITNESS: No. 22 BY MR. WEISS: 23 Q. What do you mean by professional behavior? 24 Was either Ms. McGarr or Ms. Samuel professionals? 25 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 133 1 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. 2 THE WITNESS: It's a workplace setting so 3 there is a professional code of conduct that employees 4 follow or are held to. 5 BY MR. WEISS: 6 Q. So, in other words, because Ms. Samuel is an 7 employee of the THC and Ms. McGarr is an employee of the 8 THC it's not appropriate for them to have arguments on 9 the premises. Correct? 10 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 11 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. 12 THE WITNESS: Correct. 13 BY MR. WEISS: 14 Q. And you say that because they were both 15 employees of the THC. Correct? 16 MR. ELLIS: Same objections. 17 THE WITNESS: Yes. And it's occurring in one 18 of our locations that is a workplace. 19 BY MR. WEISS: 20 Q. And where, in fact, Ms. Samuel actually worked 21 herself. Correct? 22 A. Yes. She had worked at the Hartland on two 23 occasions. 24 MR. WEISS: Now, just to deal with the 25 objection, Mr. Ellis, about, you know, me 134 1 misinterpreting Exhibit number 10 about the two 2 incidents; the one -- the first was a door slamming 3 incident; the second states, "You" -- referring to 4 Chanel Samuel -- "returned to the hotel and engaged in a 5 verbal argument with the hotel janitor." 6 And when I looked at Exhibit number 6, which 7 was the second incident report, Ms. McGarr says, "I was 8 sitting at the front desk and Chanel came in and started 9 yelling that I am the biggest hater" -- et cetera, 10 et cetera -- calling her out of her name. 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. Now, is there anything in that Exhibit number 13 6 that days Ms. Chanel strike that -- that Ms. McGarr 14 started this argument or whatever you want to call it? 15 MR. ELLIS: At 4:19? 16 MR. WEISS: Correct. 17 MR. ELLIS: You want her to read the document? 18 MR. WEISS: No. I am asking her a question. 19 Because I said -- I had made some comment about Exhibit 20 number 10, the second incident, that she came and 21 started an argument. You objected and said it doesn't 22 say in that exhibit that she started an argument. 23 BY MR. WEISS: 24 Q. So I am now referring to Exhibit 6 and looking 25 at that, is there anything in there, Exhibit 6, that 135 1 shows that Ms. McGarr initiated any kind of verbal 2 altercation? 3 MR. ELLIS: Objection. The document speaks 4 for itself. Asked and answered. 5 BY MR. WEISS: 6 Q. You may answer. 7 A. At first I heard you say Mr. Ellis so I 8 thought you were actually asking him a question, but you 9 are asking me? 10 Q. Right. 11 A. And you are asking me if anything in this 12 second report pertains -- 13 Q. Correct. 14 MR. ELLIS: Do you want her to include Exhibit 15 10 as well? 16 BY MR. WEISS: 17 Q. We will get to that. 18 A. So can I read the report? 19 Q. Absolutely. 20 A. "I was sitting at the front desk and Chanel 21 came in and started"-- 22 Q. Read it to yourself, please. 23 A. Oh. 24 Q. When you said can I read it? I meant so you 25 can again refresh your memory about what it says. 136 1 A. Sure. I get it. I am unaware that you are 2 asking me a question pertaining to the incident report 3 and what your question is. 4 Q. All right. Let's start again so you'll be 5 crystal clear. 6 A. Thank you. 7 Q. Exhibit number 6, is there anything in that 8 exhibit that would indicate to you Ms. McGarr started 9 any sort of verbal argument with Ms. Samuel? 10 A. No. 11 Q. Did you receive any information from any 12 source that the incident at 4:19 p.m. on May 29, '08, 13 that Ms. McGarr was the initiator of any sort of verbal 14 conflict? 15 A. No. 16 Q. Okay. So then going back to Exhibit 10 where 17 we are getting to Mr. Lopez's recounting of the numerous 18 incidents, as he calls them. The first one is the door 19 slamming, the second is the verbal argument. 20 Now, the fact that it looks from every piece 21 of information that you have that Ms. Samuel was the 22 initiator of this, quote, "verbal argument" with the 23 hotel janitor, would you consider that abnormal or 24 erratic behavior? 25 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Misstates the 137 1 evidence. Incomplete hypothetical. Vague and 2 ambiguous. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. You may answer. 5 A. Okay. 6 MR. ELLIS: Can you read back the question, 7 please. 8 (Record read as follows: 9 "QUESTION: Okay. So then going back to 10 Exhibit 10 where we are getting to Mr. Lopez's 11 recounting of the numerous incidents, as he calls 12 them. The first one is the door slamming, the 13 second is the verbal argument. 14 Now, the fact that it looks from every 15 piece of information that you have that Ms. Samuel 16 was the initiator of this, quote, "verbal argument" 17 with the hotel janitor, would you consider that 18 abnormal or erratic behavior?") 19 THE WITNESS: Yes. 20 BY MR. WEISS: 21 Q. Okay. And then, "Finally on 5/30/08 at 11:30 22 a.m. hotel staff witness you hitting the hotel janitor 23 on the head with a metal pipe." Would you consider that 24 abnormal or erratic behavior? 25 MR. ELLIS: Vague and ambiguous. Incomplete 138 1 hypothetical. 2 THE WITNESS: Yes. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. Now, was Ms. Samuel evicted from the hotel? 5 A. We submitted paperwork for an eviction. 6 Q. Was she evicted from the hotel? Yes or no? 7 A. No. 8 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 9 BY MR. WEISS: 10 Q. Was her tenancy ever terminated? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. How was it terminated? 13 A. Abandonment. 14 Q. Okay. Let's go to number 11. 15 (Eviction Request marked Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 11 16 for identification.) 17 BY MR. WEISS: 18 Q. Have you had a chance to look at that? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Have you ever seen that document before today? 21 A. I have. 22 Q. When did you first see it? 23 A. On or after June 2. 24 Q. Now, it says -- there is like a circle with a 25 line through it and it says -- "On-site case manager: 139 1 Eddy Husband and Laure McElroy witnessed the aftermath 2 of Chanel's physical assault." 3 Is Eddy Husband a site case manager? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. And Laure McElroy is also? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Were they present when you came in there and 8 saw Ms. McGarr on the floor in agony? 9 A. Laure was. I don't remember if Eddy was. 10 Q. So was Laure standing there next to you when 11 you saw Ms. McGarr on the floor? 12 A. No. I recall Laure being in the basement. 13 Q. Wasn't that where Ms. McGarr was? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. But you just don't know if Ms. McElroy saw her 16 on the floor? 17 A. I don't recall if Ms. McElroy saw her on the 18 floor? 19 Q. Well, if Ms. McElroy is in the basement when 20 you are there and you saw her on the floor, would there 21 be something obstructing Ms. McElroy's vision so that 22 she couldn't see Ms. McGarr on the floor? 23 A. I don't know. I recall seeing Laure not in 24 the lobby but in the basement. 25 Q. At the same time as you were in the basement? 140 1 A. No, I was not in the basement. I was at the 2 top of the stairs. 3 Q. Didn't you go down to the basement? 4 A. No. There is a hallway from the basement 5 door, the hallway goes straight, it turns to go 6 downstairs. I was at that doorway where it turns to go 7 down the stairs. 8 Q. I see. And that's where you observed 9 Ms. McGarr? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. You never went down to the basement at all? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Any particular reason why not? 14 A. The emergency personnel were there. I did not 15 want to get in their way. 16 Q. Did you take any action on this eviction 17 request? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. What action did you take? 20 A. Signing off on an eviction request, I recall. 21 Q. This is an eviction request, Exhibit 11. Did 22 you sign off on this in some way? 23 A. It's standard procedure that a general manager 24 submits this and then standard procedure is a cover 25 letter on top of this that I sign off on. 141 1 Q. Okay. Where do you sign off on it? 2 A. At the mid portion of the document. 3 Q. I just don't see your signature anywhere on 4 here. 5 A. Well, I am recalling -- Well, I am trying to 6 explain standard policy and -- 7 Q. But you might just want to answer the question 8 is my point. 9 A. Okay. 10 Q. You said you signed off on it. I am asking 11 where you signed off on it because I don't see your 12 signature. 13 A. Oh, not on this document. 14 Q. Where did you sign off on it? 15 A. I don't know if -- it's not this document. 16 I'm just presuming, I guess. 17 Q. Where did you sign off on the eviction 18 request? 19 A. On a cover sheet for this document. 20 Q. We never got a cover sheet to this. What 21 would the cover sheet look like? 22 A. It's right in front of you. 23 Q. Let's mark this as number 12, I guess. 24 (Nuisance Eviction Request marked Plaintiff's Exhibit 25 No. 12 for identification.) 142 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Have you had a chance to look at number 12? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Is your signature anywhere on this document? 5 A. It is. 6 Q. Where is that? 7 A. It is at the midpoint above Supervisor. 8 Q. Okay. Now, one says "Nuisance Eviction 9 Request" and number 11 says "Eviction Request." Why the 10 difference in those two documents? 11 A. Well, when it comes from a general manager at 12 the site, they check a box either nonpayment or 13 nuisance. When we, as property supervisors, put 14 together an eviction request, we use one or the other, 15 we have two separate sheets. 16 Q. So then you respond by taking whatever they 17 say, you get the form for that and you fill it out? 18 A. I review the packet and I put this together. 19 Q. What packet was there, except for eviction 20 request, this one page document? 21 A. I don't recall. This is standard to receive 22 this. If there is any supporting documentation for 23 non-payments, it's three days. If there is any 24 threatened violations for nuisances, we put a packet 25 together and submit it all together. 143 1 Q. Well, okay. Nuisance eviction request, number 2 12, the top half of this paper, is that all your 3 handwriting? 4 A. It is. 5 Q. What is "last ditch conference"? 6 A. What last ditch conference is is really called 7 a housing retention conference and it is a point of -- 8 it's an opportunity for management, both support 9 services department and property management department, 10 to come together and meet with tenants when it's 11 appropriate, after a lease violation, to help someone 12 retain their housing by having a meeting and having them 13 agree to a contract that we come up with and everyone 14 signs off on and the contract goes into effect. 15 Q. So you have the reason no last ditch 16 conference is: Egregious violence? 17 A. Correct. 18 Q. You mean by Ms. Samuel. Right? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. And you have, "Nuisance information: Chanel 21 attacked an employee on 5/30 in the hotel." That's your 22 writing. Correct? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. You wouldn't have written that if you had any 25 doubt that Ms. Chanel attacked her, would you? 144 1 A. No. 2 Q. And then, is the next line "No reasonable 3 stipulation"? 4 A. "No behavioral stipulation." 5 Q. What does that mean? 6 A. So when we go to court where the tenants are 7 non-payment, we often agree to a pay and stay. 8 Occasionally on nuisance cases, there will be a 9 behavioral stipulation, that's a court agreement. And 10 for this, we said no behavioral stipulation. 11 Q. Okay. And then the line below that kind of 12 thick line dividing the page, James Holland's name is 13 crossed out and it's got "for" and there is another 14 name. Whose name is that? 15 A. That is mine. 16 Q. And that is your signature, isn't it? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. How come Mr. Holland's name is crossed out and 19 your's is there? 20 A. In his absence, I assume his duties. 21 Q. Okay. Who is Melissa Blizzard? 22 A. She was at the time the director of support 23 services. 24 Q. Is that her signature? 25 A. It is. 145 1 Q. So is this like people singing off that the 2 nuisance eviction should go through? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. And then Comment, I can't read that. What 5 does that say? 6 A. At the bottom? 7 Q. Yes. You see where it says Comment? 8 A. I do. 9 Q. I know it says "until steps below are taken" 10 but I can't read the first part. 11 A. I can't make out what some of those words are. 12 "Until steps" are the only things I can read. 13 Q. And it says, "Contact the DA or PD and see if 14 she will voluntarily relinquish her tenancy." Whose 15 handwriting is that? 16 A. That handwriting is Randy Shaws's. 17 Q. And then it says in parentheses, "I assume she 18 will not get bail." 19 How come -- do you know why you wanted to have 20 her voluntarily relinquish her tenancy rather than just 21 evicting her? 22 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 23 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 24 BY MR. WEISS: 25 Q. Did you ever talk to Mr. Shaw about this? 146 1 A. He handed me -- 2 MR. ELLIS: Did you ever talk to Mr. Shaw 3 about this? 4 THE WITNESS: Yes. 5 BY MR. WEISS: 6 Q. What was your discussion with him about this 7 document, Exhibit 12? 8 MR. ELLIS: I am hesitant to have her -- 9 Mr. Shaw is an attorney and I'm not sure which of the 10 communications would have been protected by the 11 attorney/client privilege. So in the absence of knowing 12 which ones were, I am going to deem that they all were. 13 MR. WEISS: Well, this would be a waiver if 14 they were. 15 MR. ELLIS: Potentially. 16 BY MR. WEISS: 17 Q. But why would you want to have Chanel Samuel 18 voluntarily relinquish her tenancy rather than just 19 evict her? 20 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 21 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 22 BY MR. WEISS: 23 Q. Well, because of this comment by Mr. Shaw, did 24 anyone contact the DA or PD to see if Ms. Samuel would 25 voluntarily relinquish her tenancy? 147 1 A. No. 2 Q. Okay. Let's go to number 13. 3 (Notice of Belief of Abandonment marked 4 Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 13 for identification.) 5 6 THE WITNESS: Can we take a break? 7 MR. WEISS: How long would you like? 8 THE WITNESS: Five minutes. 9 MR. WEISS: Absolutely. 10 (Off the record.) 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. Back on the record. One thing I forgot to ask 13 you about Exhibit number 12, does every nuisance 14 eviction request go to Mr. Shaw for review? 15 A. It used to; it does not anymore. 16 Q. When did that change occur? 17 A. I don't recall. I think it's a month or two 18 ago. 19 Q. Okay. Now, back to Exhibit 13, Notice of 20 Belief of Abandonment. Have you ever seen that document 21 before, this particular one? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Was that part of the eviction packet as you 24 described it? 25 A. I don't think so. 148 1 Q. Now, do you know why the THC went from 2 eviction request to abandonment as a way of removing 3 Ms. Samuel from the premises? 4 A. She was not on-site for two weeks -- 5 Q. Right. 6 A. -- when this was put together and her rent had 7 been unpaid and we chose to proceed with an abandonment. 8 Q. So I guess my question is: Between June 3rd 9 of '08 when the eviction request came up and June 16 10 when the abandonment request came up, what changed the 11 thinking to go from eviction to abandonment? 12 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 13 THE WITNESS: The thinking was that she -- 14 from the time frame, an abandonment, the process for it 15 moves quicker than an eviction for someone that's not 16 present in the property. So she was not on-site and had 17 not paid rent for two weeks allowing us to proceed with 18 an abandonment. 19 BY MR. WEISS: 20 Q. But nonpayment of rent, that's a three day 21 notice. Right? 22 A. Well, nuisance cases are three days notices as 23 well. 24 Q. And after three days, you can file an unlawful 25 detainer suit. Right? 149 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. And that's five days response time? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. And after that you get a default? 5 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 6 THE WITNESS: It's possible. 7 BY MR. WEISS: 8 Q. You've taken part in evictions and advising 9 tenants before. Correct? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. So if a tenant doesn't answer an unlawful 12 detainer lawsuit, don't you just get a default or a 13 judgment? 14 A. The landlord can go to court and get a default 15 judgment. 16 Q. And that's slower than an abandonment 17 eviction? 18 A. It's slower that an abandonment eviction? 19 Q. Is that what you were saying? 20 A. It can be. 21 Q. Because my question is why would you go from a 22 nuisance eviction to abandonment? Why not just serve 23 her three day notice? 24 MR. ELLIS: Asked and answered. 25 150 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Easy to serve her; she is in jail. 3 A. We serve our tenants on-site and we don't 4 really have the means to go serve people off-site. My 5 understanding from this is that we proceeded with an 6 abandonment because we legally were allowed to do so. 7 Q. I understand that, but -- so you're saying the 8 reason is, no one can server her over at the county jail 9 at 850 Bryant? 10 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 11 hypothetical. Calls for speculation. Asked and 12 answered. 13 THE WITNESS: We don't have the means to go 14 out and serve people off-site. 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. What do you mean you don't have the means? 17 A. Staffing. 18 Q. Don't you hire a process server? 19 A. We don't normally do that. 20 Q. Because a party can't serve a complaint. 21 Right? 22 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Vague and ambiguous. 23 Incomplete hypothetical. 24 BY MR. WEISS: 25 Q. If THC is a party to an eviction, i.e., the 151 1 plaintiff, they can't serve their own complaint, can 2 they? 3 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 4 hypothetical. Calls for speculation. Vague and 5 ambiguous. Calls for a legal conclusion. 6 THE WITNESS: We serve our three days -- 7 BY MR. WEISS: 8 Q. That's not my question. 9 A. Okay. 10 Q. My question is: You have worked many times 11 with tenants involving -- regarding evictions. Did you 12 ever learn that a party to -- a plaintiff to an unlawful 13 detainer case cannot serve it's own complaint? 14 A. Yes. But we are -- yes. 15 Q. Okay. Okay. Let's go to number 14. 16 (E-mail string with top one dated 6/17/08 marked 17 Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 14 for identification.) 18 BY MR. WEISS: 19 Q. Why did you write this e-mail? Let's take it 20 from the top of the page. It's from you to Hartland 21 Hotel manager. Who is Steven? 22 A. The assistant manager. 23 Q. Why did you write that e-mail? 24 A. To -- let me read it first. I wrote this 25 e-mail to him to inform them of the timeframe for us 152 1 being able to 86 Chanel from the property; therefore, 2 not allowing her back on-site according to our 3 procedures. So I wanted them to have that information. 4 Q. Did anyone advise Mr. Lopez to do the notice 5 of abandonment, which was previous exhibit, number 13? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Who advised him to do that? 8 A. I advised him to put that together. 9 Q. Why did you do that? 10 A. Because it was what I was informed of that we 11 would be doing. 12 Q. Mr. Shaw told you to do it? 13 A. I recall being told by either Randy or James, 14 my supervisor, that we would be doing that. 15 Q. Did they say why? 16 A. I believe it's because we can proceed with 17 abandonment under those circumstances and we chose to do 18 so. 19 Q. And then the very last sentence of that 20 e-mail, "At this point just make sure staff knows that 21 if she were to return while the abandonment is still 22 outstanding to notify Jesus immediately". Why did you 23 say that? 24 A. Because if she was seen on this property, then 25 the abandonment would not go through and Jesus should 153 1 know that immediately, since the last time she was 2 on-site, the incident occurred and her leaving, being 3 taken away by the police. 4 Q. Is that the reason for the second part, the 5 other e-mail on the same page, so everyone knows if she 6 shows up, what to do? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Okay. Let's go to number 15. 9 (E-mail dated 6/17/08 marked Plaintiff's Exhibit 10 No. 15 for identification.) 11 12 BY MR. WEISS: 13 Q. Take a look at that. And who is Krista? 14 A. Krista is the Director of Housing. 15 Q. Where does she fit in the hierarchy? 16 A. She is the director of the department, and we 17 have five or six or seven directors. So different 18 departments. She is at the head of hers. 19 Q. Is she like higher on the chain than 20 Mr. Holland? 21 A. No. Housing, Property Management, Support 22 Services, all the directors are on the same level. 23 Q. Okay. Why did you write this e-mail? 24 A. Because I learned that she was not in the 25 database where our tenants have records as a current 154 1 record. 2 Q. And I was wondering here, the statement, "She 3 would have an additional balance of 3/14 to 7/31," does 4 that refer to her payment of rent? 5 A. Yes, it refers to rent. 6 Q. So she never paid rent -- It says, "She signed 7 her lease on Friday 3/14 for unit 601 and she never paid 8 rent." So she never paid rent ever since moving in 9 there? 10 A. That's what we found out on this day. 11 Q. On 6/17? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. No one ever reported that she didn't pay rent? 14 A. It was unknown. 15 Q. No one knew that -- 16 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 17 BY MR. WEISS: 18 Q. No one knew that she didn't pay her rent ever? 19 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 20 BY MR. WEISS: 21 Q. Strike that. Let me ask it this way. Who 22 keeps track of the rent payment of tenants? 23 A. The housing department. 24 Q. So by this Exhibit number 15, are you saying 25 that no one at the housing department ever realized that 155 1 Chanel never paid her rent? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. That's interesting. Then the next sentence, 4 "She would have an additional balance of 3/14 to 5 7/31/08." What does that mean, additional? That she 6 would owe more money? 7 A. I am seeing here that from March 14, which is 8 her start date of the lease, that she has a balance 9 through the end of July for the month of July. 10 Q. What do you mean by balance, that she has a 11 balance? 12 A. I guess rent owed. 13 Q. Okay. No one ever tried to evict her prior 14 about unpaid rent? 15 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 16 THE WITNESS: No. 17 BY MR. WEISS: 18 Q. What's a move out form? 19 A. When a tenant moves out of THC, we have a move 20 out form that property management starts by filling out. 21 Q. Let's take a look at number 16 here. 22 (Tenant Move-Out Form marked Plaintiff's Exhibit 23 No. 16 for identification.) 24 BY MR. WEISS: 25 Q. Okay. This is a called Tenant Move-Out Form. 156 1 Did you ever see this particular document before 2 concerning Ms. Samuel? 3 A. I don't recall. 4 Q. That looks like Mr. Lopez's signature at the 5 bottom? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. It's got date of departure 7/3/08. Is that 8 the when the abandonment expires or time for 9 abandonment? 10 A. Yes. It was set to expire on that day. 11 Q. And under date of departure, it's got a bullet 12 point: "If tenant is evicted this date will be the date 13 the sheriff posts the eviction notice." Where does the 14 sheriff post an eviction notice? 15 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Calls for speculation. 16 THE WITNESS: Sheriffs post an eviction notice 17 on doors, tenants units. 18 BY MR. WEISS: 19 Q. Why do they do that? 20 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Speculation. 21 THE WITNESS: When there is a judgment -- 22 BY MR. WEISS: 23 Q. Yes. 24 A. -- in an eviction case, setting a tenant for 25 an eviction day, the sheriff comes by and posts a notice 157 1 of eviction. 2 Q. Have you ever had the sheriff serve a notice 3 of eviction on a tenant? 4 A. I think it's standard that they come and post 5 on the door for the date that the eviction is going to 6 happen. 7 Q. My question is: Have you ever had the sheriff 8 serve an eviction notice? 9 A. What do you mean by an eviction notice? Like 10 a three day notice? 11 Q. A three day notice. 12 A. No, I don't think so. 13 Q. Who serves those? 14 A. Our desk clerks, our staff. 15 Q. If the tenant is not around, who serves them? 16 A. Well, we try to serve in person, and it is 17 often the desk clerks who see the tenants most often. 18 Q. Okay. And reason for move-out, it's got 19 "Jail". Right? Do you see that? 20 A. Uh-huh. 21 Q. What does that mean? I know what jail means. 22 But reason for move-out: Jail. Does that mean that 23 they are coming back or what? 24 A. At the time Chanel was in jail so that was the 25 category that would fit best. 158 1 Q. It's got "Other: Posted abandonment." What 2 does that mean? 3 A. Oh. So it was -- we also posted abandonment. 4 So we are also stating on this form, that's the process 5 that was taken. 6 Q. I know what I was going to ask. In a case 7 like this -- let me make it clear. Did Ms. Samuel have 8 any property at the room after she was kicked out? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. What happened to that property? 11 A. Jesus received a phone call from an agency 12 that works in jails and the woman coordinated with Jesus 13 to pick up property. 14 Q. Okay. Did anyone from the THC list the 15 property that was to be taken over? 16 A. I don't know. 17 Q. Do you know if any drug paraphernalia was 18 found in her room? 19 A. I don't know. 20 Q. How did you know at the time of this document, 21 Tenant Move-Out Form, that Ms. Samuel was still in jail? 22 A. So -- Well, we hadn't seen her. And, also, 23 the information from the district attorney was that she 24 was still in jail. 25 Q. Aren't there cameras in the lobby of the 159 1 hotel, Hartland Hotel? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Are any tapes or records made of the daily 4 view of the lobby? 5 A. The system records from the cameras and I 6 don't know how long it remains on the system. On 7 occasion, we go and review the camera and we will pull 8 information off of that. 9 Q. Was that done concerning any incidents of 10 May 29 between Ms. Samuel and Ms. McGarr? 11 A. I don't know. 12 Q. So I guess -- I thought we had asked for stuff 13 like that, I can't remember. So you don't know if there 14 is any tapes or anything left from that? 15 A. No. 16 Q. Were there cameras in the area where the 17 assault -- the alleged assault occurred? 18 A. I don't think there is any cameras in the 19 basement. 20 Q. Do you know who a Steve Vein is? 21 A. Steve Vein? 22 Q. Yes. 23 A. No. 24 Q. V-E-I-N or something like that? 25 A. V-E-N, there is a staff person with a first 160 1 name Ven. 2 Q. Was there ever a manager -- do you know any 3 managers named Steve to managed the Jefferson Hotel? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Do you know why anyone would be subpoenaed 6 from the Jefferson Hotel to testify at the preliminary 7 hearing? 8 A. No. 9 Q. I'm going to ask you a few questions about the 10 investigation of the incident. Did you take part in any 11 investigation of the incident of the alleged assault of 12 May 30, '08? 13 A. The follow up, yes. 14 Q. What did you do? 15 A. Signed off on the eviction request for Chanel 16 Samuel. 17 Q. I am talking about investigation, not evicting 18 her. 19 A. I'm sorry? 20 Q. The investigation of the event, not the 21 eviction. Did anyone ask questions of tenants or other 22 people? Did they notice anything weird about Ms. Samuel 23 or Ms. McGarr? Were there any drugs involved? That 24 type of thing. 25 A. So did I ask any questions of tenants? 161 1 Q. Yes. 2 A. I spoke -- regarding the incident, I spoke 3 with Jesus, the manager. I spoke with my supervisor. I 4 didn't speak with tenants directly about the incident. 5 Q. Did anyone? 6 A. I don't know. 7 Q. Did you ever learn at any time that anyone 8 from the THC investigated the alleged assault? 9 A. No. 10 Q. Okay. Exhibit number 17. 11 (Code of Safe Practices marked Plaintiff's Exhibit 12 No. 17 for identification.) 13 14 BY MR. WEISS: 15 Q. Do you recognize that document? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. It is called Code of Safe Practices. Right? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. And on the third page of this, is that your 20 signature where it says Employee Signature? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. And I take it that you were familiar with 23 the -- Well, you read this document, number 17, before 24 you signed it? 25 A. Yes. 162 1 Q. Did you understand it when you signed it? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Okay. Let's go with number 18. 4 (Drug and Alcohol Use Policy marked Plaintiff's 5 Exhibit No. 18 for identification.) 6 7 BY MR. WEISS: 8 Q. Was that your signature at the bottom? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. And right above your signature it says, "I 11 understand that as an employee of Tenderloin Housing 12 Clinic I am responsible for being aware of and abiding 13 by this policy." And you read that before you signed 14 it. Right? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. And you signed it, it looks like, on 3/28/05? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. So you knew in May of '08 that the Tenderloin 19 Housing Clinic was concerned about the use of alcohol, 20 illegal drugs, or controlled substances by staff. 21 Correct? 22 MR. ELLIS: Objection. Incomplete 23 hypothetical. Vague and ambiguous. Misstates the 24 document. 25 THE WITNESS: I understood we had a policy for 163 1 drug and alcohol in the workplace. 2 BY MR. WEISS: 3 Q. Well, this is it. Right? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. So everything in this document you understood 6 when you signed it. Correct? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. And you understood that it applied to 9 employees of the Tenderloin Housing Clinic. Right? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Whether they are a floating janitor or whether 12 they are a property supervisor? 13 A. Regardless of classification, yes. 14 Q. Even Mr. Shaw. Right? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Just wondering. Let's go to the next one 17 here. It looks like it's 19. 18 (Anti-Harassment Policy marked Plaintiff's Exhibit 19 No. 19 for identification.) 20 21 BY MR. WEISS: 22 Q. This is a document called Anti-Harassment 23 Policy. And on the very last page of this document, on 24 page four, is that your signature? 25 A. Yes. 164 1 Q. And before you signed this document, did you 2 read it? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Did you understand it before you signed it? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Let's go to 20, there is two pages to that. 7 (Code of Professional Conduct/Staff Rules marked 8 Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 20 for identification.) 9 10 BY MR. WEISS: 11 Q. There is a document entitled Code of 12 Professional Conduct/Staff Rules. Is that your 13 signature on the second page? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. And before you signed it, did you read and 16 understand this document? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. And you initialed the section, "No staff 19 member will have possession of or under the influence of 20 any illegal drugs or alcohol in the hotel"? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. So you knew that. Right? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And that would apply to any employee of the 25 THC? 165 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. And, additionally, there is a provision that 3 says, "Violent behavior, threats, verbal abuse, or other 4 willful actions that in any way jeopardize the safety of 5 THC staff or tenants will not be tolerated and are 6 strictly prohibited." You knew that. Right? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. That would apply to Ms. Samuel as well? 9 A. Yes. Any employee. 10 Q. This is number 21. 11 (Tenderloin Housing Clinic Administrative Policy 12 Acknowledgment and Receipt Form marked Plaintiff's 13 Exhibit No. 21 for identification.) 14 15 BY MR. WEISS: 16 Q. And this document, number 21, is that your 17 signature? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. So you did receive and read a copy of the 20 Tenderloin Housing Clinic Employee Handbook? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Okay. I need to take a brief break. I need 23 to go through some notes. I might be done here very 24 shortly. 25 (Off the record.) 166 1 BY MR. WEISS: 2 Q. Okay. We are going to be done very shortly -- 3 unless you want to go really long, I can do it. 4 Now, the discovery responses, I want to ask 5 you about that. We sent the THC special 6 interrogatories, form interrogatories, request for 7 production, and request for admission, and they were 8 verified and you signed the verifications. Correct? 9 A. Um -- 10 Q. You did. I could show you if you don't 11 believe me. 12 MR. ELLIS: That's not my recollection. 13 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 14 MR. WEISS: Let's help. Let me help you. Are 15 they in here? 16 MR. ELLIS: I identified Colleen responsive to 17 form interrogatory 1.1 as one of the people who assisted 18 in the preparation of the responses, but I believe the 19 verifications were by Janie Lara. 20 THE WITNESS: Where did I see that? I can 21 represent to you that she did. I just can't seem to 22 find it. 23 (Off the record.) 24 BY MR. WEISS: 25 Q. Let's go back on the record. Ms. Carrigan, 167 1 did you sign verification for the discovery responses? 2 A. I don't recall. 3 Q. Did you ever see the discovery responses from 4 the THC? 5 A. There were questions that were asked -- 6 Q. Yes. 7 A. -- I recall being able to answer some of those 8 questions. 9 Q. I must be mistaken. I thought I did. Do you 10 have regular work hours -- strike that. What are your 11 work hours at the THC? 12 A. Monday to Friday 9:00 to 5:00. 13 Q. So if I go till 5:00, you don't have to go 14 back to work. Right? 15 A. Don't let that be your motivation. 16 Q. I am just trying to be helpful. Do you know 17 if you are scheduled to appear to testify in the 18 criminal proceeding in the future? 19 A. Not that I'm aware of. 20 Q. Since the preliminary hearing, have you ever 21 talked to Chanel Samuel's lawyer? 22 A. I spoke to him in the courthouse that day. 23 Q. I mean since that. 24 A. No. 25 Q. Have you received any communications 168 1 whatsoever from the public defender's office after the 2 preliminary hearing? 3 A. No. 4 Q. Did you ever discuss with Mr. Lopez what his 5 testimony was at the preliminary hearing? 6 A. I don't recall. 7 Q. Was Ms. Samuel ever given a verbal or written 8 warning concerning anything she did during her 9 employment at the THC? 10 MR. ELLIS: Prior to 5/29? 11 BY MR. WEISS: 12 Q. Prior to May 30 of '08. 13 A. Okay. As her supervisor? No. 14 Q. Are you aware of any? 15 A. I am not. 16 Q. Was the last time you saw Ms. McGarr when she 17 came into the office? 18 A. No. 19 Q. When was the last time you saw her? 20 A. When I was on the bus. I boarded a bus that 21 she was on. I'm not certain when it was, an estimate 22 would be October. 23 Q. Of '08? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. I guess that's all the questions I have for 169 1 now. You may go. Don't leave town. 2 MR. ELLIS: I think I have one thing to clear 3 up. Can we go off the record. 4 (Off the record.) 5 EXAMINATION BY MR. JOHN ELLIS 6 BY MR. ELLIS: 7 Q. Let's go back object record. I want to clear 8 something up. Did you have conversations with Chanel, 9 verbal -- I know the question asked was regarding verbal 10 warnings and verbal warnings is a specific term -- 11 A. We have paperwork for that. 12 Q. -- let me ask the question -- verbal warnings 13 has certain -- that term has characteristics within THC. 14 But you did have certain verbal discussions with Chanel 15 prior to 5/30 that could have been deemed an 16 admonishment of sorts. Correct? 17 A. Yes. 18 MR. ELLIS: Thank you. If you want to follow 19 up. Otherwise I am done. 20 FURTHER EXAMINATION BY MR. WILLIAM E. WEISS 21 BY MR. WEISS: 22 Q. When you say "could have been deemed a 23 warning" -- was that the question? 24 MR. ELLIS: Admonishment. Was Chanel 25 admonished on or after 5/29 responsive to the incident 170 1 reports that Mydra filled out. 2 THE WITNESS: Yes. 3 BY MR. WEISS: 4 Q. What was the admonishment? 5 A. I spoke with Chanel and I said: I received a 6 report that your interaction in the lobby earlier today 7 occurred and I was concerned about that. And I asked 8 Chanel for her side of the story, what happened, tell me 9 what happened. And part of my response to her was, I 10 was concerned that the behavior was inappropriate, the 11 tenants that were present were upset. And part of what 12 I wanted -- needed to do is to follow up with Jesus at 13 the hotel regarding that behavior in the hotel since she 14 was a tenant at the hotel. And that was my conversation 15 with her regarding that. 16 Q. Did Mr. Samuel ever deny any of the statements 17 that Ms. McGarr put in either incident report to you? 18 A. I didn't speak specifically about statements 19 in the incident report. 20 Q. Uh-huh. 21 A. I spoke generally about a report I received. 22 So I didn't say: Statement that Mydra said to Chanel. 23 When I investigate an incident, I don't 24 divulge specific information or specific people that 25 have brought a complaint to my attention. 171 1 Q. Well, did you tell her that there had been 2 complaints about her and Ms. McGarr at the Hartland 3 Hotel? 4 A. What I recall saying to her: I received a 5 report of an incident at the hotel earlier that day 6 involving her and Mydra and I needed to hear from her 7 what happened, so I allowed her to tell me what her side 8 of the story was. And I spoke about my concern for any 9 incident that was disruptive in the hotel; that tenants 10 may have been upset by that incident; it's confusing if 11 a tenant goes behind the front desk area, it's a staff 12 area; that would be following up with Jesus, the 13 property manager at that hotel. 14 Q. What did Ms. Samuel say in response? 15 A. She said she got it. I remember her saying, 16 "I get it, yeah." And one of the things she also gave 17 back to me was: "Well, maybe you, Jesus, Mydra, and I 18 can sit down." 19 And I said: Well, I don't know that that 20 needs to happen right now, maybe we can talk about that 21 later. But what I need to do, as a property supervisor, 22 is follow up with the GM, if there is a lease violation, 23 that you might receive a written warning or a written 24 violation for an incident in the hotel that was 25 disruptive. 172 1 Q. I thought she said was destructive. You said 2 instructive. Right? 3 A. Disruptive. 4 Q. Oh, disruptive. Okay. That's all I have. 5 (The deposition of COLLEEN CARRIGAN was concluded at 6 3:05 p.m.) 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 173 1 STATE OF __________________________) ) ss. 2 COUNTY OF _________________________) 3 4 5 6 7 I, the undersigned, declare under penalty of 8 perjury that I have read the foregoing transcript, and I 9 have made corrections, additions or deletions that I was 10 desirous of making; that the foregoing is a true and 11 correct transcript of my testimony contained therein. 12 13 EXECUTED this ____ day of _________________ of 14 20 ___, at ____________________, ___________________. [City] [State] 15 16 17 18 19 20 _________________________ 21 COLLEEN CARRIGAN 22 23 24 25